DhhD

I said something like this - 8 year sago - that Wahnabism - of the Saudi-Arabian branch is one of the worst enemie of the World -not just the West - but in reality the rest of the world - and was told by some on another forum - to show i - and shut up becouse I had no clue about what I was talking about.... Saudi-Arabia was "our" friend - and I was in the wrong...


I guess I was right then - and I am right now - as many others also is saying the same thing - that Wahanbitism is a danger for the rest of the world.. A collegue of me who I worket with some years go, who is from afghanistan - once told me that saudiarabians is bad pepole - and really bad muslims - he should know as he lived in Afghanistan in the 1980s and 1990s - when saudi-arabians was traveling to the country to do their holy wars... He had to leave his country - becouse he was in danger of beeing killed by some of the larger war lords who dosen't like his ideas about how to govern the contry.. And he ended up in Norway of all places...


Diclotican

could leave the Middle East and They would stop Bush's Wars and help rebuild the balance of power in the Middle East. Iraq was by then a modernized and Westernized country. The Arab League wanted to put a bipartisan Sunni and Shia democratic government in place in Iraq. And they would have jailed OBL. Of course the War Hawks in Washington and the Military Industrial Complex intertwined through out the World wanted government contracts to continue at the ruin of the American economy-the trillions of dollars squandered and also used to bail out Wall Street 1%ers 2007-08. Keep in mind the killing and/or plundering of millions of Middle East civilians (IS beheading as revenge according to their statements at the killings).

The War Hawks wanted to set up for continuing war so they did not let the Balance of Power be restored. They are working hard badgering President Obama and the American people to again make the same mistake, rearming the opposition so they can continue to fight the same wars that they have been fighting since Mohamed died; yes this sect against that sect for about 1400 years now! Are the American people going to be fool enough to re-engage 650AD thinking? We will be going down the funnel further, if Obama succumbs to continue in this craziness.

DhhD

The Big problem is that the Saudi-Arabian royal family dobble-speak - at one side they state they want US to leave the saudi-arabian Pennsylvania - and that they should also leave the whole of Middle east - and that the need for the US to stay in the area are no more - specially after Iraq had been "liberated" and the old enemy Saddam Hussein al Takriti was no more... The problem is that the same royal family speak of another history behind the scene - they are scared as hell about the possibility of a secular - democratic Iraq - or for that matter of a peacefully Middle east - where they brand of Islam would hold no sway other than in Saudi-Arabia itself...

Iraq in 2007 was not at peace with itself - it might have had an democratic election - mired by people and places been blown up by others who was in disagreement with the election - and have aces to a lot of dynamite - and even if the Arab League wanted to have a bipartisan Shia and Sunni government in place - the reality is that Shia and Sunni seldom or never have managed to govern tighter - in the history of the muslim faith... And the years between 2003 and 2007 have already devastated any prospect of a peacefully Iraq where Sunni and Shia could live in peace with each others - in a united Iraq for the next decade or so.. The denial of US and UK as a occupying force from the get go - with all the responsibilities an occupying state have on another states soil - to protect it against inner and foreign enemies - and to rebuild what is destroyed - was something the US and UK was just not interesting in - and it was not helped by the US firing of all in civil service - and the iraqi military by Paul Bremmer who was the highest ranking civilian leader in Iraq under most of the US occupying of Iraq - it was some of the most STUPID moves the US ever did when they fired more than a million member of civil service - and then the 500.000 strong Iraqi military - and gave them just a months pay to boot - it was an Arron's and stupidity that have mired Iraq to this day.... Even after WW2 in Germany the US was not that stupid - that they fired everyone in governance in Germany - nether Soviet or USA and UK and France was that stupid -that they fired all who had worked for the former regime of Nazi-Germany - in fact most of them who was not directly responsible for crimes against people - was retained as part of the civil service in Germany - in some places even up to the early 1980s.. Doctors - teachers - and a lot of other professionals who had been "Good germans" before and under the war - but who was not seen as dangerous for the future - they was retained - even if they had a future who was less than clean.. Why could not the US do the same in Iraq in 2003-04?. Why should they fire everyone who have had a position in the old regime - and release it with - nothing.. And I think most of the problems Iraq have today - is from th fact that Iraq was never given a Chance in hell to build a progressive, democratic government - from the get go - the US firing of everyone who have had a position of power in the old regime - was killing of any resemblance of a future for the Iraqi people - and was a arrogant - and stupid move from the Bush administration....


I for some doubt Obl would have been arrested by any member of the Arab League - the fact that OBL in his last years could live more or less in the open - under the nose of the pakistani army - who had one of its main bases right at the doorstep of OBL says what is worth saying about the possibility of OBL ever to face justice - the Arab league spoke in forked tungs so to say - and would contour to talk both ways - until OBL was killed in 2010...


Groups like ISIS (I refuse to call it the Islamic State) would always have a excuse for its behaving - if it was not for the Iraqi war - it would have been something else - Al-Quada gave the reasoning that US was on >"holy grounds" in Saudi-Arabia as a reason for blowing up USS Cole back in 2000 - even if it was not blown up as planned - and the next year when US was hit by aircrafts used as missiles in NYC and at the Pentagon - extremists claimed to defend itself against US aggression - because it was stationed military forces at saudi-arabian land - at the invitation from the Saudi-Arabian royal family who had been afraid for a long time because of the military forces of Iraq - and when Iraq was no longer a treat - the fact that Iran is still a power player to reckon with and Shia to boot, the Sunnis and Shia have some issues going back to the 600th century - and never resolved.. Something like between Catholic Church and the Orthodox Church back in the days... And who also have a few bones to pick with the US for the last 30 or so year... Even though Iran prober ly is the one country in the Middle east - who have the best Chance of making it to a democratic state if they was given the chance - and the hardliners was booted out of the government..

I do hope President Obama is smart enough to not go down the same road as GWB did - to further alginate the west from the middle east - but I am not sure what the President should do - at the present it is impossible to do not do anything, and it is not easy to do something either... I would advice him to use cation - and not to listen only to the ones who want US to wage a war against ISIS on behalf of the rest of the middle east... But then again I suspect President Obama to have access to Intel that neither you and me are able to get our hands on - i just hope the intelligence system are giving him honest information - so he is able to be as educated he can, before he decide to do what he need to do....

Diclotican

They are the worst enemy. You can't beat ideology. You can't.
I also view the modern American tea party as our own wahhabbists. They are a group longing for a time and way of thinking that never actually existed.

Fucking scary.

There is an OP on the Texas Group about his lying.

There are some scary people in this world waging murderous war and destroying our Planet. I used to think that no one would ever be delusional enough to use an atomic/hydrogen bomb again. That was before Ted Cruz was elected to represent human beings.

I agree. Scares the living shit out of me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Succession_to_Muhammad

The succession to Muhammad concerns the varying aspects of successorship of Muhammad after his death, comprising who might be considered as his successor to lead the Muslims, how that person should be elected, the conditions of legitimacy, and the role of successor. Different answers to these questions have led to several divisions in the Muslim community since the first century of Muslim history; most notable giving rise to Sunnis, Shias and Kharijites.

more interesting reading at the link

Not at this link but interesting reading is the fact that Muhammad and his mother and sister were Christians before Muhammad starting having his dreams and visions. During his life in power, all citizens in Arabia were able to worship the One God as either Muslims, Christians, Jews, etc. In Chapter 3 of the Koran, Muhammad writes that the way to heaven is though Jesus Christ. Muhammad disappeared when he went to the visit the Dome on the Rock-Jerusalem. Muslims believe that he ascended in to Heaven there. ISIS wants to get rid of Kharijites and Christians in the Levant and in the rest of the World. Maybe that is why Obama says that ISIS, is Godless.

Also don't forgets, the boko haram idiot also practice Saudi (I think its the only form) of Wahhabi islam.

Fundamentalism, in general, is about to destroy the planet.

own graves, as they were surrounded by IS hoards for 2 months. No electric, no water, nothing. They said they would suicide rather than be taken by IS looters. In the other town survivors fled to a mountain top area. A close area had a major dam. All these small ethnic groups have lived there for hundreds of years. IS barbarians threatened to move towards Bagdad.

Iraq gov requested help. Country of Kurdistan requested help, the Kurd fighters are fierce ground fighters. They didn't have weapons or any air targeting systems. Those countries do not want IS barbarians looting their countries. Yes, the USA provided air support and Iraq gov/Kurdish fighters managed to work together finally and push out those threats. They still fight on the ground to kick out the rest of them.

President Obama has said 100 times or more, no USA ground troops. It is the Iraq govs job to provide a ground army and to coordinate with their Kurdish neighbors and any of Syria's ground fighters they want to work with.

I think once those IS are pushed back into Syria and we air strike that beheading coward, threatening camera camp, the USA job is over.

Let the middle east countries deal with Syria's civil war and Syria's criminal leader Assad.