He deserves an honorable retirement.

I would be sad casting my vote for someone else

Why not? He's been the VP of a popular 2 term dem president. Obama's approvals are fantastic for a lame duck.

Biden has been a long time elected dem so I think he can run if he wants to. He has dem party support. I doubt I would vote for him in the primary.

But never as SECSTATE - his foreign policy credentials have always been overstated, IMO.

But I believe that he has been an outstanding Veep.

He really is a policy wonk, and he has a veritable encyclopedia of facts and figures immediately to hand when discussing any odd country or regional issue--he's quite remarkable in his knowledge level--down to the minutiae, way better than people realize or credit him, in fact. He's a really quick study, too. I think he's been very helpful to Obama in that regard.

The truth is, I doubt his wife would "let" him take that gig (by this, I actually mean she would not be happy and that would impact his decision-making process) --and he is a "peace at home" type of fellow. Special Envoy might be a better fit, at the end of the day. Still "in" it, but not full time.

that with all his long-term experience on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee - even to being its Chair from June 2001 through 2003 - he still couldn't see through the Bush-Cheney BS on Iraq and did not just vote FOR the IWR, but effectively led the charge for it in the Senate.

Even those of us with access to a LOT less information could see through the Bush-Cheney BS - just as we could with Thomas.

I believe that there is still a lot that Joe can do from the sidelines ("Special Envoy" would be a good fit, as you say) and he is a great guy. He also does deserve a rest and some time to grieve. Running for US President has become such an endless freak show, especially on the GOPer side, that I almost wouldn't wish it on anyone.

then. I felt the same way about the IWR as I did about the entire Reagan Presidency...."Gaaah, this is such utter BULLSHIT, this is NOT going to end well, these assclowns do not know what they are in for....they are stupid, stupid, STUPID and wrong as all get-out!!!!" .... but at the end of the day, my POV didn't hold sway. A lot of people who freaked out at the dead in New York City (and the freak-out reverberated for over a decade, even NOW you can shut people up by saying "NAHN WUN WUN" in some quarters) reacted viscerally and wanted to go kill people and they didn't really care who.

Politicians who survive know how to pick their battles. Biden's state is very interconnected with the financial industry (the whole credit card game) and the financial industry, whose beating heart is Wall Street in NYC, took the big Nahn Wun Wun hit. He would have been committing suicide if he'd gone any other way.

Same deal with the Thomas confirmation. I hate that "Bros before Hos" expression--I find it offensive and dismissive and denigrating--but that was the calculus he made. I took one listen to Ms. Hill and I flat-out KNEW she was telling the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but. To this day I admire the HELL out of that woman for walking into the lion's den like she did.

I can really dislike the positions that someone takes on this issue or that, and still understand the political calculations they made, why they made them, and the arc of their career as to good calls and bad ones. I can't turn my back on Biden because he fucked up here and there, but I do agree that he's probably not the best fit for the POTUS gig. Not with his personal family issues of late, or his health history....and the fact that he can at times be a lightning rod doesn't help, either.


Undecided Voters:

Much appreciated!
(That said, that video clip is damned depressing, even if spot on)

For what that is worth.

Some things reverberate, no matter how many decades intervene.

You can't tell the American public what they should or shouldn't remember (and in some cases, learn for the first time).

Politicians will have their past dug up--everything they've said, written, done--and if they're not comfortable with the scrutiny, or if the public finds a bone worth gnawing on, it can be an issue. It doesn't have to be "fair," either.

Of course, anyone who runs will have everything including the kitchen sink thrown at them, but I think Biden would be a strong candidate if he decides to run, though I do think he'd be a long shot to get the nomination.

It's a bit late in the day for him to jump in--which is why I don't think he'll do it, but I could be very wrong with that guess, too.

They especially love trotting out the Neil Kinnock tape and running it side-by-side. They get positively gleeful when they have an excuse to do that.

Then they suggest that the AVMs are indicative of serious ongoing problems, and when people hear "brain surgery" they do get squeamish and afraid. There's a huge learning curve on these things, I think it might be a bridge too far. I also think Biden isn't the type to stand in the way of history, and HRC has the potential to make history. If he jumped in, I'd see him doing a screening strategy, taking heat, drawing fire...but who knows?



One theory on a Biden candidacy (a bit dated but the basic concept stands):

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2015/02/joe_biden_should_run_for_president_the_vice_president_won_t_win_but_it_would.html

Why Joe Biden Should Run for President

The vice president won’t win, but it’d be the best thing for Hillary Clinton and the Democratic Party.

By Jamelle Bouie

It was understood when he accepted the VP slot that he wouldn't be running for President himself.

And at the risk of being ageist, he's already 72. Yeah, I know that Bernie Sanders, whom I support, is a year older, but Biden gives the impression of a man who is ready to leave public life. I think the death of his oldest son has taken a lot out of him.

I come out about 97% aligned with Sanders, with Biden (~85%) and then Clinton (~70%) on the candidate quiz things, not that I think they are very accurate or free from selection bias in their construction.

But, I'm old-school and I do think many voices in the primary are a good thing. It's sometimes even a good thing to have candidates very close in their views so that good ideas don't get hidden by a label or a personality feature.

In the old days, when votes were more important than money diverse primaries were seen as good for the candidates themselves.
The range of ideas that emerge across the primary tests those ideas support and appeal, and the good ones became features of the nominee's general campaign.

that's what he wants to do?

He's free to run but I see no upside.

One, he would have had to get in and start laying the groundwork for a campaign and fundraising before this point. Two the death of his son has to be hard on him and he needs the time to be with his family and mourn rather than be out on the campaign trail. He and President Obama have about a year and a half left and should work together to get done what they set out to accomplish.

I wish the circumstances had been different to the point where he could get in the race (and maybe he will), but I hope he gets the support he needs from his family and friends and the rest of his term as vice-president is a kick-ass time.

After all, if Beau were still alive, he could spend more time with him if he wasn't campaigning, in addition to his responsibilities as VP. My guess is that Beau begged him to run and Joe promised he would. I have no problem with him running, but I'll be voting for Bernie in the primaries.

That's how it should work.