he won't gain ground from Sanders supporters. In fact, it doesn't matter WHO the establishment sends up trial balloons for, the results will always be the same. Establishment candidates, whether Republican or Democrat, are so yesterday.

decides or for some other purpose I can't guess. Devastated by his son's expected death as he undoubtedly is, he's also a very experienced career politician. Those TV performances weren't all about sharing his grief with the world. They had electoral purpose, and there are a lot of back games we have little or no awareness of.

That alone should be enough to disqualify any candidate from consideration, wouldn't you agree?

my "biden" in quotes was supposed to be a slap at Hillary

She was asked about it again today on MTP.

If he is running, it is smart of him to let her take the heat so all he has to do is agree with her once he is in. I'm sure her campaign has already focus grouped all the possible answers and Joe can just jump on that bandwagon.

He admitted he was wrong in his vote for the IWR. As for the Anita Hill debacle, I do not believe he admitted his judgement was wrong there, nor in the MBNA dealings. The bin Laden decision he indicated we should have gone through the Pakistan government first, and I suspect he still takes that position

It is obviously up to the voters to decide

for as long as possible before putting himself under the microscope.

Right now all the press he gets is good press. If he is serious about running, he will want to ride that as long as possible.


There are filing deadlines for some of the states coming up fairly soon. I could go search for them, but why bother? If he starts missing deadlines he is not running. We will know for sure in another month or so.

He has a lot of goodwill from many because of his recent loss and he is likable.

Why declare when you don't have to do the schlepping around the country, eating poorly and shaking lots of hands. He doesn't need to spend dollars or time yet.

But I do think the image of him debating whether or not to jump in is damaging. Along with all the issues and past actions that are very worrisome.

Last edited Sun Sep 27, 2015, 02:30 PM - Edit history (1)

If he's running, he'll be coming from HRCs end of the party and he really needs her supporters. Those supporters didn't give up Clinton easily or without some unpleasantries in 2008. Biden or anyone else who want's to be the Establishment's Ivanhoe can't come in as a threat to Clinton.

That'd be much easier if H>'s numbers decline nationally by double digits, but I don't really see happening by the end of October. I don't foresee that even by January. Things may get within the usual margin of error by January. But Clinton down by double digits doesn't seem likely to me

You'll see it in the polls after the first debate.

I suspect the week after the debate we start to see withdrawls from Chaffee and Webb,

OMalley really stands to gain the most and I hope he does well Every voice to the left of Clinton helps shape the national discussion for democrats.

to keep him out

i personally still like biden but we will use his record against him if he decides to run

go bernie go

It seems that has not disqualified her.

bernie or bust

the ring I said that he was only going to get
into the campaign, if HRC starts to lose ground
seriously. That may depend on the first debate.

If that gives Bernie a good boost, then the
establishment will push him very hard to get
in as a rescuer. The party will do everything
it can to avoid a Bernie nomination.

If HRC's campaign slides, he jumps in. The bringing in Elizabeth Warren to appease Progressive wing and try and dip into Sander's percentage.

Third Way doesn't want Bernie.

BS water under the bridge dead horse. He's an excellent VP and doesn't toot his own horn. Everything you mentioned is media driven. He has until the 14th to decide, he probably will not run. He's in grief, a family to care for AND has regular VP duties.

He'd make an excellent President or maybe a VP to Mrs. Clinton or Senator Sanders. Both of them could use him.

Sanders would do even better with Joe Biden on his side. I hope they are friends & have worked together in the Senate. Has Senator Sanders worked with our VP? I don't know and have never seen them "stand together" over issues the past 7ish years.

and only became a senator in 2007 shortly before Joe Biden left the Senate. They may not have had much opportunity for interaction.

Or is this newfound concern motivated only by Hillary Clinton's second campaign for the Presidency?

Given that your short paragraph about making up his mind before the first debate can't be included, all these things could have been said about Vice President Biden before Barack Obama was inaugurated the first time.

So again I ask, did you voice these concerns oh, say about seven years ago? I'm betting you dint.

when Joe was running for the Democratic nomination and then when he was chosen VP. There is a script out there on Joe that is pretty predictable. If he does decide to run, it will all be rehashed practically verbatim. I am preparing to tune it all out this time.

He just lost his son and his heart isn't in it. The MSM, if that is to be believed (a dicey proposition), spins his potential candidacy either as grief therapy or as the establishment's safety valve against Hillary's tanking. Neither suggests he would be a good candidate.

And if he does that clip of him saying he's not qualified because he's too emotional right now - paraphrasing from memory - on Colbert's Late Night Show is going to be played over and over again non-stop.

Staying "out of the race" ensures he gets lots of media attention via speculating if he will run. This attention is also 99% positive, since he's "out of the race" for now.

He'll get in the race - Clinton's not looking all that inevitable anymore.

it is pretty smart. As soon as someone declares they're running, the attacks come out and the numbers go down. I think he IS running.

he gets included in polls, gets buzz and goes up but is still above the fray. other than a few peple being annoyed about the apparent indecision, i don't think he is hampered at all in his 'campaign' by not declaring. If it gets to the point where he thinks he could win, he will enter the race without skipping a beat, and if it gets to the point where it looks like he wouldn't win he can just say "gave it some thought, but heart isn't in it." I think his heart is in it though - he has already done quite a few things he just wouldn't do otherwise. Getting blessing of Obama and of Jill Biden, etc. It's not like he's inexperienced. He knows what he's doing.

Before you dismiss Biden as being "not presidential material," or "indecisive," or "flaky," you might consider that the man buried his son just over three months ago. The man is still likely grieving intensively. Biden is still in the throes of intense grieving -- that much was obvious during his appearance on the Late Show with Stephen Colbert a couple of weeks ago. If you have never experienced a really close loss such as Biden's, you may not realize what a fog grief can place a person in, and for an extended period of time. I don't have any children, and thus have never experienced losing a child, but I can only imagine what that would do to a person. I did have the experience of losing both parents, on December 13 and December 25, 2000 (twelve days apart), both to lung cancer. It was nearly two years before I was remotely functional again, and another year after that until I started feeling remotely like myself.

I don't think he's going to run. I think he knows he is not yet in a strong enough place emotionally -- indeed, he hinted at that during the Colbert interview. But he may be struggling with not wanting to disappoint supporters and close associates, Cut the guy a break already!

That doesn't make him indecisive. I'm for Bernie all the way, but I dislike very much how some are bashing Biden. He's done some great things. Leans a little too far to the right for me. Give him some consideration he has endured a hell of a lot in his life.

Bunch of heartless folks on this site

represent the vast number of VOTERS who you know, vote. Just brush them off your shoulders. Biden's got this.

and its been like that for years now. I've encountered my fair share. I've learned to let it go in one ear and out the other.

If he isn't then he shouldn't be VP.

The whole point of the office is to assume the presidency if needed.

I think that it is a trial balloon of sorts.

His "campaign" has always said that he would announce if he was going to run in mid-October, which coincidentally (or not) is after the first debate. If Hillary crashes and burns for some bizarre reason, not that I expect her to, they are floating Joe as the replacement.

but to be President....

I am not going to say anything negative about Joe but in deference to the other candidates he should state his intentions.

he should know one way or the other by now. It makes me think he really doesn't want to do it, but is reluctant to throw in the towel because of Beau's wish that he does run. The indecisiveness isn't doing the party any favors.

for now, HRH still has the establishment backing. Seeing her campaign plummet, and keeping in mind her '08 implosion, the establishment has Biden standing by as Plan B. No, I don't think his heart is really in it, but he's being a loyal soldier.