I know. Against being able to sue manufacturers for making a legal product.

Otherwise?

Last edited Fri Oct 16, 2015, 01:51 PM - Edit history (2)

...Sen. Sanders's position on guns isn't as progressive as Martin O'Malley's own unapologetic support of gun legislation he helped pass in Maryland, making his state the strictest in the nation on gun control. The laws he shepherded through the Md. legislature and signed include:

- Ban on magazines (an ammunition storage and feeding device) that hold more than 10 bullets;
- Ban on 45 types of semiautomatic (weapons that reload automatically but fire only once when the trigger is pulled) rifles, classifying them as assault weapons;
- Requirement that people seeking to buy any gun other than a hunting rifle or shotgun to obtain a license, submit fingerprints to police, undergo a background check and pass classroom and firing-range training;
- Ban on any rifle that has two of three characteristics — 1) Folding stock, which makes the weapon more compact for storage or transport; 2) Grenade launcher; or 3) Flash suppressor, which protects the eyesight of the shooter in low-light shooting conditions.

Sanders has also voted against forcing states to respect concealed-carry permits issued by other states - to allow people to carry hidden guns around without a permit.

Indeed, in Sander's own state of Vermont, in gaining his first seat in the House, the senator once used his less than liberal record on gun control as a wedge against Peter Smith, the Republican incumbent he defeated, who supported a ban on assault weapons.

Although Sanders recently sided with the Obama administration, voting for federal bans on assault weapons and high-capacity clips, his rhetoric on the issue contradicts the sentiment behind such legislation. In 2013 Sanders was making an argument similar to the one he made in an NPR interview which aired on the same day as the ad by the pro-O'Malley pac where he stated that, “If you passed the strongest gun control legislation tomorrow, I don’t think it will have a profound effect on the tragedies we have seen.”

He echoed that ambivalence to gun control in the NPR interview, stating, "I think that urban America has got to respect what rural America is about, where 99 percent of the people in my state who hunt are law abiding people."

"If anyone thinks that gun control itself is going to solve the problem of violence in this country, you're terribly mistaken. So, obviously, we need strong, sensible gun control and I will support it. But some people think it's going to solve all of our problems. It is not," he said.

"I can understand that if some Democrats or Republicans represent an urban area where people don't hunt, don't do target practice; they're not into guns. But, in my state, people go hunting and people do target practice. Talking about cultural divides in this country, you know, it is important for people in urban America to understand that families go out together and kids go out with their parents and they hunt and they enjoy the outdoors and that is a lifestyle that should not be condemned."

Those comments were obviously aimed at the stance Gov. O'Malley had taken in the wake of the Charleston shooting where he declared how "pissed" he was at "special interests like the NRA." His statement was a courageous reflection of his successful effort to address the issue of gun violence in his own state:

I'm pissed that we’re actually asking ourselves the horrific question of, what will it take? How many senseless acts of violence in our streets or tragedies in our communities will it take to get our nation to stop caving to special interests like the NRA when people are dying?

I'm pissed that after working hard in the state of Maryland to pass real gun control—laws that banned high-magazine weapons, increased licensing standards, and required fingerprinting for handgun purchasers—Congress continues to drop the ball.

It's time we called this what it is: a national crisis.

I proudly hold an F rating from the NRA, and when I worked to pass gun control in Maryland, the NRA threatened me with legal action, but I never backed down.

So now, I'm doubling down, and I need your help. What we did in Maryland should be the first step of what we do as a nation. The NRA is already blaming the victims of yesterday's shooting for their own deaths, saying they too should have been armed. Let's put an end to this madness and finally stand up to them. Here are some steps we should be taking:

1. A national assault weapons ban.

2. Stricter background checks.

3. Efforts to reduce straw-buying, like fingerprint requirements.

Bernie Sanders' response is basically a strawman, suggesting that 'urban' advocates of gun control, like O'Malley' are somehow against responsible gun ownership and use. Nothing in the O'Malley gun control stance and record indicates anything of the sort. Nowhere has he 'condemned' gun owners for 'hunting' or 'target practice' as Sanders insinuated.

Moreover, the line Bernie Sanders is attempting to draw between his own equivocation on gun control and liberal efforts over the years isn't progressive, it's more of a libertarian view than a Democratic one; in effect, straddling that fence on this issue of gun control. That may well be accommodating to moderate and conservative views on gun control, but it's hardly a progressive stance' - well out of line with his supporters' insistence that his politics are unabashedly progressive.

Now, on the eve of the debate, Sanders is advancing his decidedly more progressive stance on gun safety. Good for him, but his record of support is well short of what gun safety advocates have been fighting for.

Seriously. It's a welcome difference from the hit and run snark that often characterizes DU (and I plead guilty of indulging in it myself too often.)

Anyway, your points are valid that O'Malley seems to have a much deeper connectionand stronger commitment. to the issue.

I think Sanders is committed to it too, but he is somewhat more ambivalent, both because of his political position and I think because he has other priorities. Apart from the rural culture he represents, I think he really is trying to be pragmatic about trying to reach solutions that can achieve broader consensus, and have a chance of getting done. In a way, for him, it's a bit of a role reversal, because he is often seen as rigid and inflexible on his positions.

Personally, my own feelings are fairly close to Sanders on that. I support gun control, but I think he's okay on it, and it's not a make or break issue for me personally. Coming from an area similar to, and near Vermont, I understand the "cranky Yankee" culture. It's not gun nuts like some regions -- not a lot of hardcore NRA stronghold. But many people do want their guns for hunting and target practice, including people who are otherwise moderate or kind of liberal in their sensibilities.

So for people for whom gun control is a major issue, Sanders has an uphill struggle. I just hope enough people are either moderate on it, or, like me, are more concerned with other issues.

The legislation in question only applies to one specific type of legal product.

Big Tobacco and Lawn Darts manufacturers don't get the same protections.

They have to take their chances with the legal system.

Why are the interests of the 1% only important when it comes to arms manufacturers?

but good luck with that in most of the western
states in the GE. You have seen how the POTUS
was received in Oregon. Don't underestimate the
power of rural areas.

Again: I detest guns, but have learned a lot
over the years to realize that this issue should
be kept out of a major presidential race.

...it's not only unrealistic that this issue be 'kept out of the national debate' it's unconscionable. We don't change the politics by hiding from opposition.

out totally. I just fear that it may become the most
important issue.

As a matter of fact I heard that O'Malley made one
great proposal: That the federal government should
only buy weapons of the safest caliber, which might
reduce the companies, which don't.

That can be done and sounds truly reasonable. OTH
banning weapons might just get their lovers
furious.

Pot--->Kettle?

The fear I have is that if this becomes the dominant
issue, it might decide the election against the dems.

is a downplayed rendering of events, as some of us see it

How about "Sen. Bernie Sanders calls for stiffer gun control ". Ah, the truth, much better.

Frankly, he has been voting for and saying that we need stronger gun control for years. Why do you think he gets a D- from the NRA. I'm sure there are many videos up about Bernie and his speeches about gun control. But let's face it, I could list them here, but Hillary supporters wouldn't take the time to look at them, so why bother.

If you are going to post an article, at least be honest about the headline.

Z

"...the timing of his comments was noteworthy, coming three days before the first Democratic presidential debate, when he could face challenges on the gun issue from rivals Hillary Clinton and Martin O’Malley. Both candidates have called for a tougher crackdown on guns, one of the few issues where they stand to the left of Sanders."

http://www.salon.com/2015/10/10/what_bernies_gun_control_critics_get_wrong_partner/

Yet there is an explanation. It’s consistent and simpler than many pundits think. And it’s in Bernie’s own words dating back to the campaign where he was first elected to the U.S. House—in 1990—where he was endorsed by the NRA, even after Sanders told them that he would ban assault rifles. That year, Bernie faced Republican incumbent Peter Smith, who beat him by less than 4 percentage points in a three-way race two years before.

In that 1988 race, Bernie told Vermont sportsmen that he backed an assault weapons ban. Smith told the same sportsmen’s groups that he opposed it, but midway through his first term he changed his mind and co-sponsored an assault rifle ban—even bringing an AK-47 to his press conference. That about-face was seen as a betrayal and is the background to a June 1990 debate sponsored by the Vermont Federation of Sportsmen’s Clubs.

I was at that debate with Smith and three other candidates—as the Sanders’ campaign press secretary—and recorded it. Bernie spoke at length three times and much of what he said is relevant today, and anticipates his congressional record on gun control ever since. Look at how Bernie describes what being a sportsperson is in a rural state, where he is quick to draw the line with weapons that threaten police and have no legitimate use in hunting—he previously was mayor of Vermont’s biggest city, and his record of being very clear with the gun lobby and rural people about where he stands. His approach, despite the Nation’s characterization, isn’t “open-minded.”

Z

talked about gun control before Hillary.

Z

Anyone here recognize the REAL leader???

He's been here all long according to them. Same place O'Malley has been.