How exactly do you think based on the current district lines that is going to happen?

The Senate is far more likely to return to Democratic control because 24 of the 34 seats up for grabs are Republican including the seat vacated by Rubio and the seat Rand Paul holds which may be more vulnerable based on his lackluster presidential campaign and the fact that several major campaign staff are facing criminal trouble from Ron Paul's campaign.

But both of those facts are out of Sanders' control. It's hard to claim he's going to cause a wave election when he's not even out of the high 20s or low 30s in the primary.

everyone knows Hillary, and at least one third of Democrats know nothing about Bernie.

We will have a better feel in a few months

... who pay for their campaigns.

I agree with the sentiments of this poster, Sanders is on something if he thinks the GOP answer to the will of the people... hell... they don't answer to the will of their own constituents!!

if we can't vote them out now, we won't be able to vote them out of the state legislatures either over the next few years and the gerrymandering will remain in place.....

which will still be within the (first) term of whoever is elected president in 2016

I am sure she will do well with republican like minded items. She has before.

Before that she had to work with congress on?

Which makes a huge difference being that the fight takes place in the senate.

Which is why he's been hugely successful.

in poverty and about another $16,000,000 living in low income families. Only if you are happy with almost 7,000,000 adults in prison or under correctional supervision. Only if you are happy with the terrible increase in numbers of unarmed black males that have been gunned down by the police. Only if you are ok with the CIA/NSA spying on all of our emails and phone calls. Only if you are ok with disregarding the terrible torture done in our name by the Bush administration. How about the drone killings? only 1 in about 100 deaths by drones are "suspects" designated for death by our government in our name. Only if you are swell with our infrastructure crumbling, not only to our harm, but causing a terrible security problem.

Vote for HRC to continue this wonderful life. Eight more years of this and we will all be paupers and most in prison.

Yeah, that damn Obama, always doing what he can to keep kids in poverty!

drinking water. He supports Free Trade Agreements that will kill American jobs. He kills people illegally with drones. He has done nothing to help reduce the police killing unarmed black males. His DOJ has given the corrupt banksters all they wanted. He laughed off cries for accountability for torture. He embraced the Republcon disaster call the Patriot Act. He doesn't care if the NSA/CIA violate the Constitution. I can see why the conservatives love him.

The senate DOES back Obama's agenda. Whuch is why he's been hugely successful.

Where do you live?

And that is half the battle.

Obama won a landslide victory as a Democrat, had huge grassroots support, a huge Dem majority, and even then there were douches like Lieberman and Manchin etc who wouldn't play along.

We may barely win back the senate (fingers crossed) and even then nit a single Dem senator has endorsed Bernie's agenda. It will be endless intra-party fighting.

How will Bernie get Democrats to fall in line.

So tell me how Hillary will win over the same assholes who obstructed every single thing Obama tried to do?

You big meanie.

Peace

And Republicans generally won't.

Of course, there will always be the occasional exceptions on this issue or that. And there should be the bartering/compromising needed to get things passed... though this particular Republican congress doesn't have that level of rationality.

And that's the point. As long as you have an empowered Republican contingent who won't compromise, no Dem president--Obama, HRC, BS--will be able to accomplish much in Congress. Bernie is at no particular disadvantage to Hillary here. If you're argument is that HRC will have more success because she won't be aiming as high to begin with, I would question that premise, considering how this Congress has fought Obama even on some of his most centrist proposals.

Having said that, is it possible that Bernie may actually have an edge over HRC here? Possibly.

1. There has been some talk (see first link below for one example) about Bernie having more crossover appeal in the general election. (Assuming that the Republicans ultimately put up a "traditional" candidate like Bush or Rubio, there is a large group of anti-establishment Trump/Carson/Fiorina Republicans who may be up for grabs... but they're not going to be Hillary voters.) If that's the case, Bernie could conceivably bring more Dems into the house on his coattails. Enough to win the house? Not likely. But maybe he'll be able to cut the opposition there a little.

2. There are a small number of issues where Bernie has some natural allies on the right, that HRC does not have. Think the Paul/Libertarian wing, who agree(d) with him on things like NAFTA/TPP, PATRIOT act, IWR. This provides an opening for areas where he could be more effective with a Republican congress than HRC could.

3. And then there's Bernie's official answer, which I can't believe the OP hasn't heard before: Mobilizing the people to pressure their representatives. Would that be easy? No. Likely to work? Who knows. But it's arguably at least worth giving it a shot. See the second link below.

Even today, the Iran deal is a good example of them having his back.

Do you think that Dems will abandon him? I don't. In fact, I think the Democrats will back whomever is the Democratic nominee (or president). Your argument sort of loses me - are you saying that President Obama would have done more/better if backed by his party?

See: Iran deal for example.

If he rides in on the wave of a populist mandate and Democrats in congress turn to obstruction they will be finished in national politics.

He negotiated with McCain and the Republican House until it passed.

The one or two left?

Easy peasy shit.

If Sanders hadn't been a good negotiator, it would never have passed.

So voting for vets is like voting for say...infrastructure spending...perhaps a stimulus ?

But the Veterans Bill is a major accomplishment that Bernie Sanders had with a Republican House.

It's because it's vets which makes it a lot more easy to pass than anything out there.

And shows that the myth that Sanders is some starry eyed ideologue who can't negotiate with a Republican House is a total myth.

Come on--let's not make this molehill into Everest. He was doing his job.

This is a VERY mixed report card, in fact:


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/06/04/bernie-sanders-2016_n_7514328.html

special committees to look into bullshit charges - just because they hate her.
The only thing that would get accomplished, IMO, is Third Way crap that the GOP wanted to do anyway.

they did it to Obama, and will do it to any Democrat who dares exist in office when they have the majority in one or both houses.

... for him or believe

Hillary's fondness for war, fracking, H-1B visas, the TPP (as if I believe her this week), and cluster bombs are some of the reasons I cannot vote for her.

Maybe you misunderstood my post - it is not some "SLIGHTLY less obstructionist" thing, although I think things would be more than SLIGHTLY less, it is that the GOP will eagerly cooperate with Hillary on things I do not want to vote for, like war, H-1B visas, etc. I think her Third Way stuff will slide right through Congress. With a big "bipartisan" smile.

And you do not get to decide what is a good enough reason. No one does, for me, except me.

... dictators they're presidents which limited power.

Sanders is either naive or being disenginous with the "Obama was weak with negotiating with republicans" seeing he's not giving a way he can do better.

I would LOVE to see how Sanders would mobilize Trillions of people while being president at the same time... just to see it doesn't make a difference to republicans who don't answer to mobilized people.

Republicans answer to those who pay for their campaigns and that's just a few rich

Unless we're literally going to kill the rich people then the republicans will continue to answer to them WHILE in majority power.

So we should vote for Hillary because it is her turn, or something? Where are you going with the "no one can get anything done" thing?
And I repeat - I believe the GOP WOULD work with Hillary on Third way stuff. Which is not a good feature, for me.

... take a chance on Sanders seeing he's going to do the same thing right?

No, right now he's still talking in useless platitudes of "mobilizing people" seeing the GOP doesn't answer to the people who aren't rich what good does mobilizing trillions do?

I don't want to take a chance on platitudes and I think NONE of the candidates can throw stones in the area of judgement, pandering, corporatism

She keeps "evolving" for votes; I feel once she got into office, she would "evolve" to favor her Wall Street donors.
I sincerely hope you do not feel that anything you have said would induce me to vote for a candidate who favors war and cluster bombs and fracking. Because that would be ridiculous. And sad. And illogical.

... last time.

For some reason Sanders has convinced himself that Republicans will respond to 21344234 trillion people who want something.

They wont...

They have not so far

And he's talking shit

Seriously ...but man we'd need some ponies for it to happen.

Ponies? He's offering FREE Medicare for all! He will pay for it by ending GWB's 'temporary' tax reduction for the top 1%, and by charging corporations for profits they've offshored. Of course, total medical expenditures for 2014 were $3.1 trillion, and 42% of those are already covered by Medicare/Medicaid. That leaves 58% (or a mere $1.8 trillion) for the feds to pick up on an annual basis. Of course, the IRS only collected a total of $3.1 trillion in 2014, but that's just a technicality.

And there will no doubt be larger Medicarer taxes as well.

Expanding the Medicare tax would have been the responsible thing to say. But no, he said he will pay for universal Medicare by higher income taxes on the rich, and taxing offshore profits. Guess he does not think he can sell a 10. 15 or 20% payroll tax to his base.

Do better/different?

plans for the funding of her proposals.

... this issue too

But it would be nice to get a bit more than what can be accomplished via EO alone.

... on every turn bullshits this answer with some platitudes about "millions of people" or some shit... as if the GOP cares about 1234o23n trillon people have to say

So are you suggesting that you're fine with a candidate who uses EO on what they can, and gives up on the rest? If not, what's HRC's plan for the parts of her platform that can't be implemented via EO?

... Sanders can follow her lead cause he's not going to get shit down without EO.

There's no "movement" that will move the unmoveable GOP congress, they don't care... they don't have to

He's not going to get what he says he will. Look what Obama had to put up with. Please don't even start with Obama never even tried.
Bernie has been in politics most of his life, he talks a good game but I'm sure he knows how limited he will be in getting his agenda passed. Obama had what I believe will turn out to be in comparison a larger group of supporters than Bernie will have and he had to fight the GOP every step and lets not even mention the blue dogs.
Bernie doesn't even have the backing of his new party to count on.
I think whoever the dem nominee is will have a tough time winning the GE. I don't think any of them are going to pull enough voters in to overcome the gerrymandered house districts. Whoever is the next president is going to have a slugfest getting anything done.

representing the interests of the oligarchs and start representing our interests. When Bernie is talking about a 'political revolution' he's talking about an attempt to orchestrate such unrest in ways that shame/pressure Congress into doing just that.

He has said this from the very beginning.

"We need a political revolution in this country, which means that 80 percent of the people vote, not 40 percent, and which means that people demand that Congress represent the middle class and working families of this country and not just the billionaire class."

You and I and millions of others can be part of that. We will have to make a sustained effort to make it happen, and unfortunately the last time we made this type of sustained effort was in the second world war. Can we make it happen? I don't know and neither does Bernie, I suspect. But we've got to try because if we don't the world our children and grandchildren will inherit will suck. It sucks now, but it will suck FAR WORSE than we can even imagine if these oligarchs get their way.

So I guess them is us. I hate the idea, because it will mean extra work. It will mean less TV time and more politics time. It will mean sustained commitment. I'm sure what I've said won't make anyone feel much better. But, again, we've got to do it.

I don't see it happening any other way.

That's a joke.

Seriously, though, post 14 (which you see as a reasonable answer) is indeed an extension of "bully pulpit" and "grassroots movement" and the video that I and others have posted in this thread, where BS says

And it is a fault of mine for sure. I'm like a clumsy Gorilla in a China shop.

I make my points a bit too bluntly and in turn receive replies with equal bluntness.

My point is---yeah fucking right the American people will come together ---let me stop there and repeat---yeah right the American people will come together! I don't see it happening.

The humans on the right are too far gone and they ain't coming back.

mho

And I understand your frustration.

But does that mean that the only option we have is to give up?

What is the best we can hope for from a Democratic president? Merely stopping the right wing loons from accomplishing their agenda, while pretty much giving up on our own?

I guess the "good" news is that, even if that's the case, I'd say that any Democratic pres could do that much about as well as any other. And at least when looked at from an electoral college perspective, it seems very likely that the Dems will win the WH in 2016, regardless of who gets the nomination.

But, this isn't a real inquiry. It's the "repeat" part of "wash, rinse, repeat." Round 435.

The magical notion of ralLying millions of Americans.

Uh...ok

Then you've not tried very hard. He answers that very question in virtually every speech. It's also been posted here on DU numerous times.

Is that one of the answers?

Come on..help me out.

A.k.a. Democracy. So, yeah, "rallying millions." As in "rallying millions" to kick these teaklanner assholes out of the Halls of Congress. I would think even Hillary supporters could support that.

OK, I'm done here. It's Sunday night and my garden's calling . . .

Are you seeing a pattern here?

Of course they could read what Bernie has to say on the subject:

http://www.salon.com/2015/10/11/bernie_sanders_exclusive_i_never_wanted_to_be_a_part_of_such_a_soulless_politics/

But then, some people just don't want to know or understand.

ok...

Acquiescence, "bipartisan" capitulation, move further right?

And progress as the cherry on top.

There won't be "intraparty fighting" if Bernie wins, and the republicans hate Hillary with a passion. Dream on...

Republicans will hate anyone, especially someone who wants bigger govt and more socialism.

Even with gerrymandering it is possible (If there is a large enough turnout) to gain seats even in the house. The excitement is growing enough for Bernie I could see that happening. Dems will take back the Senate in 2016. I'm optimistic enough to feel we could win back the house too. If that happens and he pushes through campaign finance reform....game over. Then his entire agenda could pass. Call me a dreamer, but I'm not the only one. 11k in Tuscon..a Red state, 10k in Phoenix... this early...why not.

None.

But if the people fall behind one leader... If they are inspired, they may be able to flip some congressional seats.

nice, warm, purple space is. Smack dab in the middle where any progress dies.

I know it's taboo on DU to ever read a source that isn't 100% in agreement, er, I mean vetted, but I read a lot of conservative blogs and things, just to get a sense what is going on over there.

They hate their Establishment. And they're tired of how the party is selling them out to corporate interests. Take immigration. Now, DU wisdom is that Republicans hate immigrants because racism. But in reality, they really don't like it for reasons similar to our objections to the the HB-1 visa. They don't want a flood of cheap, foreign labor flooding the markets.

Sanders, with his economic populist message, could tap into that.

Grass roots conservatives have really turned against corporations the last two or so years. Sanders' message has the potential to resonate.

However, if your question is the Republican politicians. Well, who knows. But your question could be aptly applied to Clinton. Republicans hate, hate, hate Hillary. What will make Congress any more malleable with her?

Patriot Coal, Alcoa deal that was going to hurt some retirement plans.

Got the drug gouger dude to agree to lower prices, although she might have to pay him a visit if he doesn't do it shortly.

I just don't believe Sanders would be anywhere near as effective, assuming he were elected.

I know I should be slapped up side the head for this, but I can't help thinking of the SNL crew calling Sanders the "Lorax."

And he said that Obama did not handle the Presidency correctly. He went in to it thinking the republicans would work with him. They won't. And they won't work with Sanders. He will get things done without them because of the revolution.

That's what he said.

We haven't had a 'people' candidate since Bobby ... Students and young persons are open to Bernie's message ... There is no doubt that Bernie brings the most positive, inspirational message to the electorate, with an authenticity that NO other candidate can muster or pretend.

We need a revolution of THINKING ... We need to STOP thinking we cant toss the Tea Party out of power in congress ... We need to STOP thinking that the same ole same ole is going to change anything ... Bernie's message is one that is inclusive and focused on restructuring the national economy by restoring the fair regulations that used to exist but have been torn down by generations of greedy John Birch-ey, Tea Party-like, hyper conservatives .... With the congress in meltdown, a complete an utter embarrassment to the nation - NOW is the time to take them down at the polls ....

We are never going to get there if we aren't willing to take the next step ... If we want a forceful message to the nation and the world that the people want a fair playing field again, and we are ready to exercise our rights by voting FOR progressive reps and sens that will move to change laws to improve the treatment of regular citizens ...

We need to start with an authentic message that is believable, deep down inside .... A message that tens of millions can hear and be inspired to vote for inclusive fairness ... You are not going to get anywhere without the political will to change, and no other candidate has such a strong, authentic message as Bernie does ...

To say we shouldn't try to do the right thing because we might lose ... well ... that is too cynical for me ... People can be inspired by a positive message ...

But I think we need the other side as well.

I think that's Hillary's plan, isnt it?

Unless Hillary has magic powers no one has told us about.

The Congress controls the Legislative agenda.

The bully pulpit works only if Republicans care about what the public thinks. They don't.

the people

First Bernie's speech

Thanks for posting this!

They hate her with a passion.

gets them to work with him now.

1) Republicans have no interest in cooperating with any Democratic President, not since Gingrich came to power anyway. They impeached Bill Clinton and they began meeting to undermine anything Obama might try to achieve the day he was inaugurated. Assuming all else is constant, Hillary will face the same fierce resistance as would Bernie.

2) Changing those dynamics rather than simply making the best of an impossible situation will require engaging the American public in a way that mainstream Democrats usually seem unwilling or unable to do. The short hand term for it is populism, creating a movement.

A bastardized co-opted version of this was launched by rightest forces. We know it as the Tea Party. They even whipped up anger over Wall Street bailouts, and there is some animosity toward TPP type trade agreements in those circles also. Yes that movement had puppet masters but it mobilized tens of thousands of "foot soldiers" also. They flooded Town Hall meetings. They took over the structure of the Republican Party in widely different places at every level up to and including State Parties, and now potentially the House of Representatives too. They mounted successful primary challenges to seemingly untouchable entrenched "establishment" Republican office holders. They MOVED political debate to the RIGHT.

Hillary Clinton can not and will not be the standard bearer of a leftist populist movement, but Bernie Sanders can and will. He is willing to speak the unvarnished truth about what is happening in America today and that allows him to connect directly with a broad range of dissatisfied voters, including some who have up until now responded to the Right.

It will take a movement to recapture a wide swath of State Legislatures against the obscene power of big money arrayed against us. And it will take recapturing those legislatures in order to end political gerrymandering that allowed Republicans to solidly control the House in Congress even though Democrats nation wide got more votes than Republicans did in Congressional races.

That takes mobilizing the people with passion and conviction to confront a system that is rigged against them. Hillary would help us hold the line against further degradation. Bernie can help us turn the tide.

He has alienated too many of his peers Dems and Reps.

Obama was never able to rally Republicans, but he did a pretty good job with Dems. Most of Obama's big achievements came with having Dems side with him and out maneuvering the Reps. He was brilliant at this. Bernie cannot do this. There is absolutely no finess about him.

We are the past the point in this country when playing classic inside politics deftly enough can adequately address the problems confronting our nation. Tea Party insurgents were not exactly welcomed with open arms at first by traditional Republicans in Congress either, but increasingly they reshaped politics as w have known it on the Right. I grant you that Hillary is better tuned to the inside game, but is that enough? Increasingly millions of Americans are saying "No".

He won't. Of all the reasons to try to convince anyone to support Hillary over Bernie this has to be the most nonsensical.

such difficult questions are reserved for the non shiny object(Hillary).

Lot of wishful thinking here.

I agree that Bernie and his supporters must address the issue of the insolent Republican party.

Why would this change?

before Congress.gov existed.

Sanders has gotten more bills and amendments through this, Republican-dominated Congress than any Democrat.

He doesn't do the campaign stops, he doesn't do the fundraising assist, he doesn't do the rubber chicken dinners, he doesn't do the "sign the letter mail-out that reads 'Help my friend'...."-- he doesn't do anything to help any person with whom he caucused to get elected. Never. Not once. He has never lifted a finger to help a peer in the House or the Senate. Now, others have helped HIM. The DNC--and several individual members, one, quite notably, being Hillary Clinton--helped Sanders get elected to the Senate. Not only did she give him money from her PAC, she also steered a bunch of her donors his way.

But he thinks that people will all of a sudden jump on his bandwagon, without him ever returning the many favors he has been granted...because Bernie?

Mmm hmm.

... was the chilly relationship he had with Democrats in Congress - back when the D's controlled everything. Imagine a President Bernie against a Republican-controlled House and Senate and also having a D minority that doesn't like him.