2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumCan a person honestly support the death penalty and
racial justice?
I think the answer is no, the death penalty is inextricably linked to racial injustice and anyone claiming to support both is lying.
Sander's position on both issues is consistent, Clinton is not being honest.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)They have to live with their principles.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)72DejaVu
(1,545 posts)so, it is not inherently racist.
The current justice system in America is inherently racist, so the death penalty is, as part of that system as well. But the justice system could be, and obviously should be, reformed.
(And, btw, I'm against the death penalty personally)
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)I want to elect someone who will appoint anti-death penalty Supreme Court judges.
Murdering prisoners is morally indefensible.
TheKentuckian
(25,026 posts)72DejaVu
(1,545 posts)A person can certainly believe that the current racial injustice can be removed from the system (it may be unlikely, but it is not impossible) and that, in a fair system, the death penalty would only be applied in a fair manner.
Of course, it's a lot easier to just call anyone who agrees with you a liar, so, carry on.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)death penalty to "as it exists in reality", not some fantasy world version. Good point, "my bad"
72DejaVu
(1,545 posts)why are you even interested in politics?
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)72DejaVu
(1,545 posts)but if they are, I'd certainly want to see inequality in that administration eliminated, wouldn't you?
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)azmom
(5,208 posts)Be unfair. That's the reality of today. I would think that realizing that, she would come out and oppose it.
Todays_Illusion
(1,209 posts)LiberalArkie
(15,719 posts)Poor blacks always get the death penalty next are the poor whites.
azmom
(5,208 posts)She would also oppose the death penalty as the death penalty has been found to be applied in a racist manner.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)It begins with the prosecutors and judges and grand juries. Often they are all white, and it causes the application of justice to be tainted from the get go.
More often indictments are handed down by a white grand jury, to a white proscutor and wite judge, the defense is white, the witnesses white, the defendant black. What woukd have hapoened to that black man arrested for burglary of his neighbor's house if that little four year old girl had not told that the robbers had white skin? Years in jail, life fucked up. How many times has that happened where we had no honest little white child who was not taught to hate? We have no clue. But I think the reason we even still have a death penalty is because we have black people here. We need to fix the entire system.
jfern
(5,204 posts)42% of those on death row are black, but only 30% of those killed by the police are black.
Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)...and he supported the death penalty when I voted for him.
iandhr
(6,852 posts)His exact words were
"I support the death penalty in theory but in particle it is troubling"
dflprincess
(28,080 posts)And, given the number of death row inmates who have been exonerated, I don't understand how anyone can support it.
delrem
(9,688 posts)You're simply associating capital punishment with 'race' issues. Your argument doesn't hold since you didn't give any supporting evidence.
Capital punishment is as old as humankind.
How we deal with it is as old as humankind.
I don't know why you want to conflate these two different issues.
TheKentuckian
(25,026 posts)delrem
(9,688 posts)We don't have capital punishment up here, but nevertheless it's inherently racist.
These are different things.
I don't see how you can claim that tried to excuse the existence of racism here there or anywhere.
That isn't what I was saying.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)delrem
(9,688 posts)the problem of a racist history persists.
So, you've got the death penalty in the USA and you've got a racist culture and the result is a foregone conclusion.
You've got a big problem.
I think it's a good first step to eliminate the death penalty.
I think if the USA can't figure that out, then no, it isn't likely to be able to think through more complex issues that owe in particular to a racist heritage.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)You're simply associating capital punishment with 'race' issues. Your argument doesn't hold since you didn't give any supporting evidence.
Capital punishment is as old as humankind.
How we deal with it is as old as humankind.
I don't know why you want to conflate these two different issues.
delrem
(9,688 posts)I explained myself well enough for my conscience.
I differentiated the issues well enough to satisfy myself.
I figure I'm innocent of whatever further charges.
George II
(67,782 posts)beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Do you support the death penalty, George?
Because a lot of us have always been vehemently against it.
delrem
(9,688 posts)But to point it out isn't a "dog whistle"
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)A dog whistle is a subtle jab at a candidate that one can whistle past and claim they aren't um whatever they are accused of. I am pretty sure Warren isn't going to pretend to not be anti-death penalty and he is probably not going to claim this isn't a jab at a candidate. Are you sure you know what a dog whistle is?
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)Here is a clue: when a statement explicitly references race, by definition it cannot be a dog whistle.
Since you aren't going to look it up:
Dog-whistle politics is political messaging employing coded language that appears to mean one thing to the general population but has an additional, different or more specific resonance for a targeted subgroup. The phrase is often used as a pejorative, because of the inherently deceptive nature of the practice and because the dog-whistle messages are frequently distasteful to the general populace. The analogy is to a dog whistle, whose high-frequency whistle is heard by dogs but inaudible to humans.
wiki
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)is as likely to be executed as a black person who kills a white person, is an utter moron.
It is extremely disappointing that Obama still supports the death penalty given this horrible racial bias. Also I am disappointed in Hillary on this issue and respect O'Malley and Sanders for their stance.
BlueJazz
(25,348 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)quakerboy
(13,920 posts)Except insofar as the one is enacted by a society lacking the other.
Can a person honestly support racial justice and our nations manner of use of the death penalty? no.
But the death penalty itself(while worth opposing on its own merits) is not inherently racially unjust. We are more likely to all manner of bad things to non white people. That doesn't make all bad things we do to people independently racist. That just makes us as a group racist in our enaction of independently bad things.
Response to quakerboy (Reply #34)
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quakerboy
(13,920 posts)I in no way support the death penalty.
Admiral Loinpresser
(3,859 posts)Response to Warren Stupidity (Original post)
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