It seems most people don't get involved in the Primary until after the holidays....looking forward to seeing what happens in January!

We do need a President that puts People Over Profit,,,,and has always been a staunch supporter of equality and justice...it's time to ditch the DNC / DLC / Third Way Weenie Democrats.

They both had huge war chests, lots of political support from a range of Party leaders, strong African American support and.....

oh, wait a minute.

EOM

You may not consider Sanders any of those things, but young people certainly consider him charismatic and, more specifically, concerned about THEM.

But all this discursive nonsense will be put to bed when the actual votes are counted...I look as forward to that as much as I look forward to my next breath.

Obama had the combo of the young and the AA vote - the core of the democratic party. He would not have won without that 90%+ AA support. Even if Bernie got 100% of the young vote he wouldn't win.

Everyone keeps repeating this refrain that Sanders will repeat Obama's performance but forget that KEY thing that makes all the difference - AA support. This time it's on Hillarys side and that isn't gonna change

Hillary has the oligarchy and corporate owned media voting for her. That's for sure.

You just might keep America going in the same direction but the opportunity to make America about Americans just might resonate more than you think.

or rich. Not part of the 1%, nor uninformed. I supported Obama in the primary and general election. I am as familiar with Sanders as you and like him immensely, he could be a great President. But I think Hillary is the best candidate in this cycle and fully support her. And it's not the oligarchy and corporate owned media that will get her elected, it's the millions of regular people like me that will get her elected.

So you admit an oligarchy? Interesting. And you, and the millions of regular people approve this? Even more interesting. Then you should be prepared for this to continue, until the middle class is totally obliterated.

As for Corporate media, we all know they are bought and paid for. Think about that. If they control every word they report to you, and its coming from an oligarchy, what could possibly be wrong with that logic?

with the vast majority of Democrats supporting here along with over 200 endorsements...

Pushing a meme of your own huh?

Pot meet Kettle!

modern history. Sanders has a guy who actually wondered aloud why the DNC wasn't signing up voters at Sanders rallies. There's no comparison to be made between the two campaigns.

Bernie's war chest is huge and you know what's awesome? It's funded BY THE PEOPLE not some shitty SuperPAC like your candidate.

He would be unelectable even if he wasn't getting crushed in the polls.

The primary polls show that Hillary has a big lead, and combined with the endorsements from other politicians and unions, her fundraising edge, it is very likely that she will be the nominee.

Which is good, because if Bernie wins the nomination, we'd be at high risk of a GOP presidency.

We are both in agreement that the primary polls show Hillary with a lead to be the democratic party candidate for president.

Further you have one reason you think Bernie has an electability problem his self identification. However, the polls that you are so fond of throwing up show that this problem seems to be less than the problems with Hillary's electability.

It is a current fact that Bernie polls better than Hillary against every Republican Candidate according to the recent NBC/WSJ poll. So if you believe in polls and Bernie is unelectable, wouldn't that make Hillary more unelectable?

In addition that Poll shows that generally Hillary has a 27% rating for trustworthiness. This means that she will be targeted with and will be vulnerable to all the attack adds that will be thrown at her by the GOP. Those negative attack adds will resonate because that is the long term impression of people already.

So basically it is your opinion not supported by polls that Bernie is unelectable while Hillary is electable.

and he doesn't have the fundraising capacity to fight back against the GOP.

Hillary and Bernie both poll pretty well against the GOP right now, but the thing is, Bernie hasn't faced the GOP attack machine, whereas Hillary has been pounded by it this whole time. The Republicans are already running ads against Hillary. The whole Benghazi-email thing was an attack against Hillary, during the GOP debates, all the candidates attack Hillary by name.

And yet she's still standing strong, outpolling them in the GE.

If Bernie were the nominee, the GOP would re-target its ads on him, and he would be toast. Less than 50% of Americans would be willing to vote for a socialist -- it polls even worse than being atheist or Muslim. The ads against him write themselves. And there's never been serious oppo research done against Bernie, because he's been running in Vermont.

On top of that, he'd be outspent by something like 5-1 or 10-1. The Koch Brothers alone are going to spend almost a billion.

I like Bernie, but he's not ready for prime time.

He polls better than she does in the general election and she has much higher unfavorables in the general population and less favorables.

So it would seem that objectively and scientifically at this point the polls say she is favored to win the democratic primary but is a worse candidate in the general.

You can have opinions on how that will change but they are contrary to the polls now and there is no scientific basis for your opinion.

If i say Bernie is more electable in the general, the polls support that contention

But like I said, he hasn't been attacked by the GOP yet. Hillary has.

Hint: If you have no skeletons in your closet, you're home free. Socialist, or not.

Both have been in politics for a long time. And who has collected the most skeletons? So who will they go after?

Note: I prefer a clean closet. So does Bernie. And so does America

Keep on living in a make believe world. Remember 2008? Hmmmm.

People are fed up. They are going to voice their votes in mass numbers in 2016. Bernie has done a fantastic job since May. For him to be this close, this early, says a lot about the movement in this country. You're gonna feel the Bern, come springtime.

They're not going after Bernie, or O'Malley, and they never went after Chaffee or Webb or even Biden.

They go after Clinton because that's who they think they're going to be running against. And they're right.

that well known nationally have to be evaluated with that in mind.

"self-described socialist"?

And Obama is a black man with a Muslim sounding name, a Kenyan father and a white mother. So, what's your point?

"Unelectability" is highly subjective.

No, electability is not an exact science. But in my judgement, Bernie is unelectable. My judgement in 2008 was that Obama was electable, more so than Hillary. Obama is very different from Bernie.

A relatively unknown candidate with much less government experience than his competition, a black man with a Muslim sounding name, a Muslim Kenyan father and a white mother was more electable than a highly experienced politician with a consistent and unblemished record who happens to identify himself as a democratic socialist? Okay...whatever.

I totally agree, Bernie and Obama are two very different candidates. The strengths and weaknesses for electability, IMO, are a wash between the two. The similarity: they are both running against the exact same candidate. Obama overcame his electability issues because, it appears, Hillary's negatives were strong enough to overcome Obama's negatives.

We'll find out if Bernie can accomplish the same.

the Obama / Hillary race. It was all about money. I remember the reporting was always talking about who had the biggest "funding" - as soon as Obama pulled ahead (money wise) it was over. He was the (at the time) corporate selected candidate.

Now it seems like they've decided its time for the #2 selection.

Nobody on our side is afraid of history or Bernie or your revolution or your Democratic Socialist or any other thing you dream up.

Hillary is tough, strong, independent and has taken about as much shit as anybody alive has taken and is still kicking ass. A lot of us identify with that. We are not in the least bit afraid of you.

Bernie is no Obama

On edit,

Bernie folks are SOME of the people and are SOME of the Americans. You represent about 10% of the people at best.

Just look at his background and what he stands for. I agree Hillary is a good candidate for all your reasons. But in my mind, and many others, she's in second place. And polls don't mean squat, this early in the race.

For starters, he doesn't have Holy Joe Lieberman as his mentor:

That's a scary term, isn't it?
You can take your corporate candidate and have a nice little party with Wall Street. America is sick and tired of political bullshit while their kids suffer in student loan debt and many can't even afford food for their kids while candidates are out getting $1500 hair cuts at some salon in NYC.

Bernie isn't Obama? You're right, he's doing better than Obama is at this stage of the election and he has more $ than Obama did.
We represent about 10% of the population? Really? Tell us again why Bernie polls better in a general than Hillary?

10% of the population rofl! Check your degree in Bush math at the door. Many of Bernie's supporters are indy voters, we're the largest voting block in America and guess what? We lean solidly for Bernie.

Remind us again how we're only 10%

And HRC supporters are not afraid of Bernie. At this stage I think we're more amused by the denial of current reality.

As a candidate what attributes does the Vermont independent have that make him as good or better a candidate, as his acolytes suggest, than Barack Obama.

Thank you in advance.

I'm afraid she'll be elected and continue to sell the middle class down the road.

One is by action, one is by vote. Until individuals feel compelled to start acting the way they say they would like others too, nobody ever will. One has to practice what one preaches.

Denial is strong these days. People spend their lives devoted to achieving corporate success and then claim to personally care about the attacks against democracy they themselves fund. They speak about expanding safety nets, climate change, education, wars, police aggression, health care and lives in flowery verbiage of concern and then profit from the continued denial and outright ignorance of the causes.

We need people for the people.

the last time a progressive barnstormer attacking both parties was elected POTUS.

she has nothing to worry about.

that's the truth.

Bernie has been picking up republican votes In vermont for years.He appeals to non-Dems.

If you think we bernie supporters are hard on Clinton you haven't seen anything yet.we attack her record as corporist and neocon.
They will lie through their teeth.

The obama economic record is great for top 1% rest not as good.

"The obama economic record is great for top 1% rest not as good."

And why would THAT be? Because the fucking Congress barely passed ANY of his agenda. What did get passed saved this country from absolute ruin, but nothing that would have truly advanced his agenda got passed.

Massive infrastructure improvements?

Nope.

Massive Green Energy investements?

Nope.

Comprehensive Immigration Reform?

Nope.

Minimum Wage increase?

Nope.

The carping about the Obama record from some elements of this party is either stupid, ill-informed, or dishonest.

Yet be more conservative is exactly what you propose.

It doesn't work. It depresses Democratic turnout and we lose. This has happened over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

It's time to stop being Republican-lite and be Democrats. People will vote for us if we stop cowering in terror.

It's about time we had a boring president.

Having three major candidates is a different dynamic. Not to mention, Sanders is no Obama.

Sanders is better than Obama at this stage by every measurable metric. What are you using as a gauge?

This is 2015.