2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumBut it’s hard to attract huge crowds by calling for reasonableness.
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Leslie Lindholm and 31 others follow
Women G 4 Hillary ?@WomenG4Hillary 2h2 hours ago Gainesville, FL
http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/29/politics/hillary-clinton-infrastructure-spending/index.html
Does anyone else seem to be rolling out detailed policy plans? C'mon boys...
#HardHatsForHillary #Hillary2016
Why Hillary Clinton is more progressive than Bernie Sanders, in one sentence
By Stephen Stromberg
Bernie Sanders attracted a 20,000-person crowd in Boston over the weekend with his uncreative wish list of a platform, in which college would be free for all, Social Security would be expanded for all and medical coverage would be highly subsidized for all regardless of whether you actually need the help. Hillary Clinton finally pushed back Monday against progressives who propose shoveling public benefits at rich and poor alike. One sentence in particular drew a clear distinction between her campaign and Sanderss:
I am not in favor of making college free for Donald Trumps kids, she said, after explaining that Im a little different from those who say free college for everybody.
She then pitched her college affordability proposal, which would allow students to graduate debt free but wouldnt end tuition or work requirements. Clintons system would be means-tested: Those who can afford to invest in their educations would have to. Sanderss wouldnt be.
Sanderss platform isnt visionary, its dull...........................
Real progressives seek to show that government can operate smartly, not haphazardly. Real progressives spend money on urgent needs, not on the rich.
But its hard to attract huge crowds by calling for reasonableness.
....................................
BIG DAY FOR HILLARY IN BOSTON
Impact Democracy and 23 others follow
Tim Chaisson ?@UAOrganizer550 1h1 hour ago
@MetroBTC members out in force for @HillaryClinton in #Boston @UAPipeTrades @BK537 @busagent12 #HardHatsForHillary
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Satisfied with the status quo.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)She says she is a 'moderate' whatever that means.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... expand her appeal without being divisive. I'm guessing that she may believe that labels and absolutes can be limiting and crippling, or even liabilities. (See: socialist.)
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Republicrat non solutions.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)She's smart. She's playing to win. Not to just "shape the discussion" and come in 2nd.
bvf
(6,604 posts)I guess you think she wasn't "playing to win" at the time, eh?
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)riversedge
(70,242 posts)bvf
(6,604 posts)a hell of a lot smarter since the last time she lost.
You can make of that what you will.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts):-D
bvf
(6,604 posts)regale us with your evidence, Jackie.
Response to NurseJackie (Reply #48)
Post removed
marble falls
(57,106 posts)Armstead
(47,803 posts)She is one of the most polarizing figures in politics. .Her policies may be plain vanilla, but she sometimes manages to make them polarizing.
artislife
(9,497 posts)heh
raised eyebrows
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... or misinterpret in whatever way best suits your prejudices or motives.
(Jury Note: The word "prejudices" is used correctly and does not suggest bigotry, sexism or racism.)
Juicy_Bellows
(2,427 posts)"I am not in favor of making college free for Donald Trumps kids, she said, after explaining that Im a little different from those who say free college for everybody.
She then pitched her college afford ability proposal, which would allow students to graduate debt free but wouldnt end tuition or work requirements. Clintons system would be means-tested: Those who can afford to invest in their educations would have to. Sanderss wouldnt be.
Sanderss platform isnt visionary, its dull........................... "
Super wealthy kids like Donald Trump's kids would likely go to private colleges. Bernie's plan has no means testing so that no lame ass loopholes are created. Simple, free public university.
dull my ass - Sanders proposal is BOLD - this guy is in the can for horseshit.
Eric J in MN
(35,619 posts)Hillary Clinton's plan of college-is-debt-free-if-your-parents-pay-enough is what we have already.
Bread and Circus
(9,454 posts)Response to Bread and Circus (Reply #6)
Armstead This message was self-deleted by its author.
oasis
(49,389 posts)Armstead
(47,803 posts)They're all fucking pie in the sky, if you choose to look at it that way.
While we're at let's stop building highways with federal funds. I'm never going to be in Kansas and I'll be damned if I want to pay for their damn roads.
oasis
(49,389 posts)it doesn't involve getting rid of social security or Medicare.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)"Free" college is not free. It would be paid for by a small tax on certain investment/financial transactions.
Perhaps you don't think that is a good idea. Fine. But it's no more "pie in the sky" than many other public services that are paid for somehow through taxes or indirect payments.
oasis
(49,389 posts)If it is attainable, I'm for it.
But, does Bernie figure he can sweet talk a Republican teabag congress into more spending?
Armstead
(47,803 posts)If your defeatist attitude is that nothing can be done because of Congress, that's a much bigger issue than Sanders.
Or if you think the GOP is gonna show Clinton any more love on any initiative she might propose, you're deluded.
oasis
(49,389 posts)a record of getting stuff done on a national scale.
redstateblues
(10,565 posts)It's not "pie in the sky" like Bernie wants to make college. Free college would qualify as "pie in the sky". Building highways is not pie in the sky-it's paid for with gasoline tax.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)The Blue Traveller
(60 posts)Fuggem. Same for Alabama and Mississippi. I'll probably never visit these two states in my lifetime.
Broward
(1,976 posts)If so, I hope not too many.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)that will mean they will not pursue higher education as their parents are controlling, judgmental bigots. This 'Trump's children' routine is cute, but it's cheap rhetoric that steamrolls over the reality.
Clinton has religious, straight and financial privilege just dripping off this rhetoric. Thoughtless about the least among us, always. She's just eager to jab at Bernie's plan so he jumps in and says Rev Bigot has the right to tell his gay kid where and how to study. It's not well thought out policy at all.
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)attempting to placate them by throwing crumbs their way.
Douglas Carpenter
(20,226 posts)and are overwhelmingly popular - attempts to abolish them or privatize them or make major cutbacks on them are almost always universally opposed by the American people. Other "help the unfortunate" programs that are means tested are always politically open to cutbacks and are in general unpopular - because people frequently have trouble imagining themselves in such unfortunate circumstances. Means tested programs insure that the very poor will be often resented by the middle class and the working poor who make just enough to put them above the limits to qualify.
Doesn't Hillary know that? Surely she must?
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Vattel
(9,289 posts)Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)For Americans. We need work on the infrastructure and good paying jobs, this is a win win policy.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)And he was proven wrong.
Trump's kids don't go to public colleges. Neither did the Clintons' daughter. Very few kids of 1 percenters go to public colleges.
But, at least at Faneuil Hall, she'll have her grasshopper weathervane - suits her.
elleng
(130,974 posts)O'Malley's Plans
15 Goals to Rebuild the American Dream
https://martinomalley.com/category/15-goals/
Addiction treatment and prevention
https://martinomalley.com/policy/addiction-treatment-and-prevention/
Criminal Justice Reform
https://martinomalley.com/policy/criminal-justice/
Making College Debt Free for all Americans
https://martinomalley.com/policy/make-college-debt-free/
Holding Wall Street Accountable
https://14d2r744okfe40r1ug1oqm6y-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/OMalley-Wall-Street-Reform.pdf
Expanding Social Security
https://martinomalley.com/the-latest/expanding-social-security/
Homeland Security
https://martinomalley.com/vision/homeland-security/
Immigration
https://martinomalley.com/the-latest/immigration/
National Service
https://martinomalley.com/national-service/
Environment
https://martinomalley.com/climate/iowa/
https://martinomalley.com/climate/
https://martinomalley.com/climate/agenda/
Foreign Policy
https://martinomalley.com/policy/truman-national-security/
Gun Reform
https://martinomalley.com/policy/preventing-and-reducing-gun-violence/
Trade Policy
https://martinomalley.com/policy/trade-policy/
Campaign Finance Reform (Restoring our American Democracy)
https://martinomalley.com/the-latest/restoring-our-american-democracy/
Why We Need a Constitutional Amendment to Secure the Right to Vote:
https://martinomalley.com/the-latest/news/right-to-vote/
Veterans and Military Families
https://martinomalley.com/policy/veterans/
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)Cha
(297,323 posts)Armstead
(47,803 posts)or something like that.
Eric J in MN
(35,619 posts)...since Donald Trump's kids couldn't have free high school?
Should we eliminate free roads so that Donald Trump's kids have to pay tolls?
No. It's progressive to believe in The Commons, and to make the rich pay for The Commons by having a progressive tax system.
Vattel
(9,289 posts)It rewards mediocrity by making two years of community college free without making the first two years of a four year college free.
bobbobbins01
(1,681 posts)I'm insulted that she thinks anyone falls for that kind of crap. I like candidates that don't treat me like I'm a complete idiot. Class warfare to get people to vote against their best interests. Fuck that.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)Cha
(297,323 posts)rbrnmw
(7,160 posts)Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)Why wouldn't everyone support that message?
Eric J in MN
(35,619 posts)Last edited Mon Nov 30, 2015, 03:42 AM - Edit history (1)
Can America have free public colleges? Hillary Clinton says, "No we can't."
Can America leave marijuana regulation to the states? Hillary Clinton says, "No we can't."
Can America have universal healthcare? Hillary Clinton says, "No we can't."
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)I love it.
ibegurpard
(16,685 posts)And it's exactly right! No wonder she's not generating any enthusiasm.
pinebox
(5,761 posts)If there ever was bullshit, an article titled "Why Hillary Clinton is more progressive than Bernie Sanders, in one sentence" is it.
Progressive, eh?
Progressives don't do this;
Fight for a NON living minimum wage
Fight for the ACA which would still leave close to 30 million uninsured
Our social security on the table
College EDU that still makes people pay.
Call the TPP the "Gold Stand" over 40 times in their own biography.
Defend sending back migrant children.
Have a hissy fit about changing names when they were SOS because of name changes of gay couples
Run racist ads at 3am against Obama.
Vote for stupid wars that were NEVER related to 9/11 because an idiot has a beef his dad couldn't finish.
Suddenly declare they were ducking sniper fire.
Voting FOR the 2001 bankruptcy bill.
On and on it goes. Sorry. It is what it is.
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)riversedge
(70,242 posts)Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)"I oppose free public education because a rich person's kid might benefit too!"
Kentonio
(4,377 posts)For all those poor billionaires who are desperate for their kids to get a free education at public college..
No sorry, I can't keep a straight face anymore.
Scuba
(53,475 posts)In fact, reasonableness seems to be the big reason Bernie is drawing such huge crowds.
Source
mmonk
(52,589 posts)2008 from Phil Gramm and Bill Clinton in the 90's.