Here is what I dont understand. And I really want to.
There are hundreds of posts, dozens of threads, EACH DAY on DU outlining a gazillion alleged reasons why Hillary Clinton is really really bad. Why she is not a liberal or a progressive and it is implied that voting for her is the SAME as voting republican.
Some of the criticism is accurate and fair, much of it isnt.
I mean this is almost ALL of what goes on now in the GDP forum. There is some of the reverse, but a fraction at best.
I used to say "As a Bernie supporter", but let me just say as an American, not a Democrat, not a Bernie supporter, just as an American, what good does it do to say this over and over again when you KNOW pretty much EVERY SINGLE person who participates here has made up their minds?
Now I know why a Karl Rove would want people not to vote for Hillary "no matter what" but for the god damn life of me I dont know why anyone alleging they are a liberal would.
I must assume that thread after thread, post after post of tearing Hillary apart is meant to not just promote Bernie, but to harm Hillary (politically).
If she is the nominee, who wins when she is harmed? This is an easy one, folks.
= new reply since forum marked as read
Response to randys1 (Original post)
Just think how uneven it would be if they weren't spending half their time over in the cave!
Great post! 
I was talking about the trouble makers who just like to bash and trash, you low the ones who hate the party, yet come here to post. For the life of me I don't know why they post here, a site for democrats, instead of starting their own "anti" everything underground. 
"I await rebuttals he said."
...is a pro-HILLARY thread. You include pro-Hillary threads in your count of pro-Bernie threads, and yeah, you're gonna get a big number!
Put the big wooden spoon away and go read it, then!
Last edited Wed Dec 9, 2015, 06:58 PM - Edit history (1)
You got those "facts" from the same place you get most of your so called "facts"! I won't say where that is.
I am very critical of Hillary and I say what I think about her suitability as my president. How that translates to "bashing" or "hate" is strange to me though. She is not a victim, if she can't handle constructive criticism, she can't handle the job.
But it's her supporters, not her, that seem so thin skinned. I'm not going to coddle someone who, pretty everyone agrees, is a badass woman in her own right. If her supporters can't handle that .... I don't get it. Is she your strong feminist hero or your weakling victim?
Never mind, don't answer that. But here's what I don't understand:
It seems to me that when Hillary goes left, she's applauded by her supporters. When she goes right, she's applauded by her supporters.
Makes me wonder if, hypothetically, she were to adopt all of Bernie's positions, would she lose supporters? I cannot say but I just don't see it. Her people would follow her to the ends of the earth.
At the same time....
I'm willing to bet if you polled democrats on policy or issue alone, nearly all or most progressive dems would align closer to Bernie.
Just my observation based on the things people say and do.
campaign.
I am in NC, and we got viciously redistricted. 51% voted for Democratic state house dems last election, and yet the reps have a veto proof majority. How is that even legal? Might well have take democracy out back and shoot it in the head 
And as far as who is/is not electable in 2020, there is no way to judge. GWB looked really weak until 9/11. After that he was basically unbeatable no matter how hard he sucked. Everyone thought Jimmy Carter was just the ticket, such a good man, but he ended up being roadkill under the wheels of Ronald Reagan. He was PERCEIVED as being weak on the gas shortage and Iran hostages, and he lost. The point I am making is that luck and circumstance at play in that process. Being an incumbent helps. They mostly win.
Thanks. 
Like a dog frothing on the end of a chain, I want to kick GOP ass so bad. Cannot wait for the General. I want to roll so fast and hard that they are stinking road kill on the shoulder of history. I will do this behind ANY dem candidate. Because Hobby Lobby (don't mess with my BC) and Ferguson and Citizens United.
Their candidates are sooooo bad. We can BURN THEM DOWN if we focus. Total humiliation. 
It gets heated these days. 2008 was also bad, but I don't remember it being this bad. I usually check the board once a day, look at LBN and Greatest, but I even stopped doing that for a long time. Too much bile and also boring.
If you think about it, it is ridiculous that one parties represent such a huge spectrums of views. In a parliamentary system, there are many parties representing niche groups, but they are all forced to work with other parties if they want to get anything done. And if one pisses you off or renege on a deal, you can work with someone else.
For instance, I am passionate and far-left on social justice issues and a center-left pragmatists on economic stuff. In the parliamentary system, I can be a member of the Social Justice Party. But there are not enough of us to win an election, so we might work with the Democratic Socialists to gain a majority. If they are difficult or unpleasant, no reason we would not go with the straight-up Democrats or even Business Progressives instead. They are both ok with my social justice platform, and I am ok with a variety of different economic solutions. We all get what we really want.
Sanders supporters seem to think (in general) that the ONLY progressive issue is income inequality. And I think that is a huge deal too. But my true passion is for social justice and I am waaaay more liberal than most of them on that score. I find their lack of understanding annoying. Just like they find my lack of absolute intensity on economic issues annoying. But we are forced to be together, a shotgun wedding. I dunno, if we were able to choose, we might choose each other. But there is no choice. The Republicans are so gawdawful, I can't even contemplate voting for one beyond the local level. And they are even more fractured. We are ALL overly constrained by the system.
This is a long and complicated way to say I think the two party system sucks, is outdated, and until it changes, we will have very fractious primaries. Because voters are pissed and sick of it. Sanders peeps probably agree with me 100% on that! We just disagree on the best way to go about fixing in, or, in my case, if it is even fixable (I think only modest progress is possible).
Did you watch The Wire? The 4th or 5th season is all about a gifted and passionate young politician out to clean up the mess and cronyism of the city government. And what happens next is about right. He gets change, but incremental and with big compromises and unintended results, not all good. That's politics and that's life.
In the end, we will make the shotgun marriage work. Because Hillary Clinton can give Sanders peeps more of what they want than GOP, and vice versa. We just have to beat each other up for a bit longer first 
General "buzz" can be a momentum changer, but that is hard to engineer.
