2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumShould Bernie start thinking about ending his campaign?
He's going to lose, by now there's no doubt about that. And his people are getting desperate enough to start stealing data, a pretty clear sign that they know they need a miracle.
And the thing is, Bernie proudly points out that a lot of his money comes from people who don't really have much extra income. A lot of them, frankly, can't afford to be donating money. Just because some people are dumb enough to dump money into Bernie's hopeless campaign doesn't mean that it's ethical for him to encourage them to do so. Basically, Bernie is selling snake oil. Talking about single payer and free college when both he and his staff know that he's going to lose and none of what he's talking about is ever going to happen.
All that raising more money does at this point is let Bernie enjoy more TV time. Maybe go on for a few more weeks, but if you've reached the point where you need dirty tricks like data theft just to keep your hopes alive, I think it's time to consider encouraging those hard-working people keep their money rather than flushing it down the Bernie fundraising toilet.
djean111
(14,255 posts)Just like I am not going to think about supporting Hillary.
It's the issues.
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)He should at least wait until after Super Tuesday to see where he stands.
BlueCheese
(2,522 posts)He has the right to stay in as long as he wants. It's by no means over-- stranger things have happened in politics.
His campaign messed up in a huge fashion this week, but he's still bringing important messages to the conversation, and I think the race is better off for him being in it.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Another screw-up like this week, and his reputation could be permanently damaged. And raising money from working people to support a dirty tricks campaign isn't exactly ethical, in my opinion.
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
woodsprite
(11,916 posts)It's not the time to just hand it over to the Dino's. It's never the time to just hand it over. It's too important to give up and give in.
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
bowens43
(16,064 posts)time to start trotting out of the decades of skeletons and baggage in hill's closet.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)to start physically assaulting people?
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
DanTex
(20,709 posts)data, not the DNC.
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)I think that once he loses, he'll refuse to endorse Hillary.
He always knew running as a spoiler only spoils a single election but to truly destroy a party, it must be done from within.
Given his rants against the Democratic Party over the past 30 years, I suspect his goal all along was to destroy our party.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Cassiopeia
(2,603 posts)Your fear is showing. Might want to pull those shades a bit tighter.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)pengu
(462 posts)Bernie thanks you.
The Boss
(63 posts)If Clinton does not get the nomination at the end, don't tell us that we didn't try to warn you.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)The Boss
(63 posts)and will have to move on to a nice retirement, helping her daughter raise Charlotte.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)marmar
(77,084 posts)Hiraeth
(4,805 posts)I think in the long run this may hurt Sanders in the GE a bit but I think the fallout probably takes Hillary out of this race.
She simply has more to lose unless every bit of fallout goes her way...Sanders seems largely resistant to the consequences of this; his supporters don't care, they view this as a war to wrest control of the nation away from center-rightists like Clinton and right-wingers like the GOP...war justifies many uncivil action.
Bernie may lose the battle and the day in the scandal...but it seems more-likely that Hillary's candidacy is fatally-wounded when it all shakes out.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Logic like that explains why Bernie is so far ahead in the polls.
Chan790
(20,176 posts)Bernie's team steals data. Bernie's supporters are like "All day long IDGAF", it's not going to change anything for them...war is uncivil and anything that takes out Clinton is justifiable. There are literally no possible consequences for this...worst-case scenario, the guy that was fired has to fall on a sword and say he did it without the knowledge or permissions of anybody above him and didn't share the results of his actions...and the buck stops with him. They can all go in and say that much and leave. He goes to prison a Scooter Libby for a few years and gets a cushy pillow upon landing on release.
Hillary, on the other hand, is the front-runner. She has more to lose. the next 3 weeks at least are going to be filled with reports and journalistic investigations into whether Camp Hillary did it too. Sanders camp's malfeasance isn't going to be newsworthy for as long because they news-vomited it all in one day and it'll clear as fast. Also, this is a discovery nightmare...if Sanders doesn't drop the lawsuit, her people are going to have to leave the campaign trail to undergo deposition and discovery...and that's the least of the problems. When they do, they either have to lie and perjure themselves...or they have to tell the truth and hand the Sanders campaign their entire strategy, playbook and information against the Sanders campaign. If they do the first, they will be stalked out of the race because people are going to go over it with a fine-tooth comb looking for the "gotcha!" lie they can indict Robbie Mook and/or Hillary Clinton over. If they do the second, they literally have to hand the Sanders campaign everything DWS and Mook accused them of stealing yesterday.
This is much worse for Clinton than Sanders. It's the political equivalent of running into the opponent's armory, stealing the grenade-pins along with their battle plans and covert operatives list and leaving out the back door. You're a thief but all the carnage of the explosion is going to be in the enemy's camp.
Autumn
(45,109 posts)restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)i would love to see her out followed by a civil discussion by bernie and martin as the primaries roll on. OTOH, i want all their skullduggery to come out in discovery and force her out in the shame that they so deserve for subverting our democracy.
chocolate, buttercrunch, its a tough choice!
last1standing
(11,709 posts)There's no excuse to spread lies when you've been repeatedly shown that they're lies in other threads. What makes you think it's acceptable or a good way to promote your candidate - the proven liar?
DanTex
(20,709 posts)last1standing
(11,709 posts)I said you posted a lie. Please learn the difference before posting more lies.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)is someone else's fault. Don't let reality hit you too hard in a few months, though.
last1standing
(11,709 posts)At least your supporting the candidate who best reflects your actions.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)RBInMaine
(13,570 posts)Whereas Hillary and most Dems take a more realistic approach. Bernie on has government spending as a plan, and that isn't enough. You need a private sector jobs growth plan too.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)tech3149
(4,452 posts)I spent most of my adult life being militantly apolitical. Even as a kid I saw the corruption of the political process. I saw two party leadership people tank progressive candidates because they put the screws to party funders.
This old fool will not tolerate politics as usual. It's time for the revolution.
Remember that quote from Kennedy? " Those that make peaceful revolution impossible make violent revolution inevitable"
I don't want to descend into violent revolution but between the madness of the Republican party and the clusterfuck of the Democratic party what choice do we have?
You soo funny, Bernie more TV time? FFS any TV time is more than he's gotten so far.
Alfresco
(1,698 posts)Rosa Luxemburg
(28,627 posts)there's probably a lot that has been going on behind the scenes. When it comes out Hillary will be toast.
moobu2
(4,822 posts)panader0
(25,816 posts)restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)what color is it in your world?
i give you an A for effort and persistence, dan!!
philosslayer
(3,076 posts)March 1 is Super Tuesday. On the morning of March 2nd, Sanders supporters will awake to reality.
LexVegas
(6,070 posts)SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)So sad
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)I am happy that you enjoy the things as they are
Fearless
(18,421 posts)oasis
(49,392 posts)I can't see him maintaining the present pace of the campaign. It's only going to be a rougher ride from here.
Leftyforever
(317 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)livetohike
(22,147 posts)since Ed Schultz went off the air and he lost his nearly daily free air time.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)Alfresco
(1,698 posts)Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)Thanks.