2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumImagine the fit Hillary supporters would have if the DNC chair
was a Sanders loyalist, advancing his interests above other candidates.
Sure, you're fine with the status quo, but it shouldn't be difficult to understand why supporters of the other two candidates are less than enthusiastic about the status quo.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)and Sanders got a stern lecture instead of access cut off we would see endless threads about how unfair it is. Hillary would sue if her access was cut off and rightly so. But, I have a hard time imagining her supporters would have come out 250,000 strong to make donations and show solidarity by demanding Hillary get her access back.
JustABozoOnThisBus
(23,350 posts)there would be 10 supporters shelling out $250,000 each.
She'd be just fine.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)Hardly a surprise from you, janey.
Matariki
(18,775 posts)It's like pulling the string on a See and Say
Proserpina
(2,352 posts)My mom still has hers, and it still works. She plans to retire on the proceeds.
Matariki
(18,775 posts)mopinko
(70,127 posts)no joke. my cousin was in charge of branding for mattel.
Aaaahhhhhch perfect!!!
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Perfect!
Phlem
(6,323 posts)Oh noes someone hid my post, I'm hurt, they're so awful..........But you guys are above all that and have never engaged in similar activity.
Tell Santa about it.
JonLeibowitz
(6,282 posts)This happens all the time on DU.
So yes, they(Jackpine) are above all that.
did not know that when I referenced it.
JonLeibowitz
(6,282 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Rah! Rah! Rah! GGGooooooooooo IT!
Hey, nice bus they funded!
pangaia
(24,324 posts)Plucketeer
(12,882 posts)Oh - that's Right = "pacifier"
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)I pointed that out to someone else here and they didn't see any problem at all with Hillary going into Bernie's data and using the donor list from Bernie's campaign to solicit funds.
The Bernie campaign wants an actual independent audit to determine the extent of the breach from BOTH sides.
If it turns out Hillary stole data from Bernie I'm sure you will have a new talking point. Something along the lines of, "Donor lists are shared property of the party available to all" with a reminder that Bernie isn't a REAL Democrat anyway.
Ivan Kaputski
(528 posts)Seeing reports of Clinton team trolling the Bernie email list.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Ivan Kaputski
(528 posts)mwooldri
(10,303 posts)... and found out the hard way that it wasn't. If Sanders' team (or any team for that matter) were worried about data security they'd have an independent third party to do this stuff so that there is at least plausible deniability about stealing another campaign's data.
There are people who do this for a living. Some people call them "white hat hackers".
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
murielm99
(30,745 posts)throws fits, tantrum, and screams? Her behavior in this has been classy. Bernie, his campaign and his supporters are the ones throwing fits.
Don't judge others by your own behavior and standards.
Nice try.
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)I thought we were talking about her supporters, not her.
See... Bernie supporters don't think they are attached to the candidate at the hip.
Neither candidate threw a fit at any time over this. Ol' Shultzy did tho! When right to the press like a Rovian clone.
Vattel
(9,289 posts)"OMG, he was saying that I shouldn't shout because I am a woman. Waaaaahhh!"
leftofcool
(19,460 posts)Here's the deal. Bernie staffers got caught red handed! End of story!
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Rah! Rah! fucking Rah!
The Second Stone
(2,900 posts)Imagine the fit Sanders supporters would have if Hillary pulled out and endorsed Trump!
Imagine if Sanders staffers had not committed these illegal hacks.
Imagine if Sanders supporters were as mature and grown up as Sanders. Most of them are. But not all.
artislife
(9,497 posts)The Second Stone
(2,900 posts)Sanders staffers committed acts which could be charged here. Imagine rainbows and puppies. What's your point? That the Sanders supporters on the DU are largely divorced from maturity and reality? Point made. It's a long race between now and the convention. Sanders is working hard to win it by being mature and constructive. Try not to undermine it, he might actually be the nominee.
artislife
(9,497 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)But Bernie will persue it to the bitter end. In her giddy, knee jerk pouncing to destroy the Sanders campaign, she broke a legally binding contract in multiple ways. She believed he would just drop out like Dean did, but she underestimated him, he has sued her for breach of contract, and now DWS/Hillary can't get the genie back in the bottle!
I find the situation she is in to be...delicious!
eridani
(51,907 posts)The Sanders tech people were investigating a leaky firewall problem that had occurred before. They reported it before in October but nothing was done about it. I can fault the techies for not clearing their plans at a higher level, but not for anything else.
Explain this, wise one--if they were "hacking," why did all their temp accounts get tagged with "bernie"?
DNC backed off because they didn't want the Sanders lawsuit publicizing Clinton's 2008 hack.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Fact is DWS/Hillary are now being sued for DWS actions. We will find out if the Hillary campaign is working in coordination with the DNC. If so then they are in biiiig trouble!
eridani
(51,907 posts)--documentation of Clinton's hacks in 2008.
Yallow
(1,926 posts)Now that would be something!
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)(And I would be gravedancing)
in_cog_ni_to
(41,600 posts)because it's ALL TRACEABLE. Then we'll see excuses galore. Then it will be acceptable.
PEACE
LOVE
BERNIE
Snotcicles
(9,089 posts)Lazy Daisy
(928 posts)think about it. Something similar happens to you years before. You get read the riot act, slapped on the wrist and told "bad campaign".
Now comes 8 yrs later and oh hey, you know what got us in trouble......... If we just drop the firewall enough times.......
somebody is bound to take the bait.................
above scenario not beyond the scope of modern politics
Chef Eric
(1,024 posts)Last edited Sun Dec 20, 2015, 06:48 PM - Edit history (1)
Imagine if Clinton winds up as the nominee, and THEN an independent investigation finds out that members of Clinton's staff had done some snooping.
There would be a storm of outrage, and justifiably so. The fact that NGP-VAN is headed by Clinton's former CTO would make the situation even more fishy.
Many Bernie supporters who would have been willing to vote for Clinton in the GE could easily change their minds. Who could blame them?
This is just one more reason to make sure that Sanders wins the nomination.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Not a pleasant subject for contemplation.
Oilwellian
(12,647 posts)FBI investigation.
Duval
(4,280 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Drop That Kick!
Drop That Kick!
NorthCarolina
(11,197 posts)Either it was to allow HRC camp access to Sanders campaign data, or as hopeful entrapment of Sanders campaign workers. My guess, probably both.
in_cog_ni_to
(41,600 posts)NGP VAN was up to no good, as instructed by DWS and HRH.
PEACE
LOVE
BERNIE
democrank
(11,096 posts)Status quo cheerleaders don`t make a habit of rocking the boat. So, anyone with opposing ideas, a different way of doing things....well, just won`t do. Rule #1 is....Revere the Machine. Just do it and do not make waves.
murielm99
(30,745 posts)The DNC chair is a Democrat. Sanders is not a Democrat, never has been. Now he is running as a Democrat, mooching off the party, using its resources.
Neither he nor his supporters nor his staff have any sense of decorum.
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)No he just always caucuses with them....
He's a liberal, unlike many 3rd way Dems.
murielm99
(30,745 posts)AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)Anyone can put a "D" next to their name. Fox News proves that repeatedly.
Actions speak louder than name brand loyalty.
murielm99
(30,745 posts)Sanders just proved it, and after years of disdaining, criticizing and refusing to join the party. Now he is using them, and his supporters would like to wreck the party.
Anyone, including Trump, can put a D after their name. A lot of the posters here make me wonder. I am sure many of them are not Democrats, would never vote for a Democrat, never had that intention when they became Bernie "supporters."
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)Delusional much???
Wreck the Third Way... which has already wrecked the party.
draa
(975 posts)Pathetic.
murielm99
(30,745 posts)I did not say that and you know it.
We all know what you mean. We've heard that same crap for weeks now. That Sanders wasn't a Democrat and therefore shouldn't be allowed to run as one now. As far as I know he changed his affiliation to Democrat so he's a Democrat. That's all that matters. Clinton supporters seem to want a purity test like the GOP demands and it's speaks volumes.
Like I said, he's a Democrat now so just stop with that nonsense.
newbie with no star membership.
draa
(975 posts)I've been a member for 5 years now. And what the hell does a star have to do with anything. Once again, you demand purity with that star. Just pathetic all the way around.
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)Just wanted to repeat that.
ChairmanAgnostic
(28,017 posts)artislife
(9,497 posts)He actually ran as a democrat so that it wouldn't be a Nader move.
Is that something you want?
I could get down with him breaking away and running as an independent now.
in_cog_ni_to
(41,600 posts)That's all this is. If he had run as an Independent, he would be crap on the bottom of their shoes. Running as a Democrat - since he didn't want to be another third party loss and because he has caucused with the Democrats for 25 freakin' years, he's now crap on TOP of their shoes! He ruined the coronation.
He's going to win too. Can't wait to see the shitstorm when that happens!
PEACE
LOVE
BERNIE
artislife
(9,497 posts)They just wish it would all just go away...it is 2008 all over again.
JTFrog
(14,274 posts)That isn't a very long time to build up loyalty now is it? Especially when it's someone who spent the last few years trashing the Democratic party and President Obama.
Just sayin.... Does this really have anything to do with "loyalty"?
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)mefoolonhill
(454 posts)I'm wondering if the lawsuit filed by the Sanders campaign a couple of days ago is still active? Maybe withdrawl of the suit is part of the deal with DNC to get Bernie's data access restored. Does anyone know for sure about the status of the lawsuit? It could be a very big deal if they allow the Sanders team to go into full discovery.
in_cog_ni_to
(41,600 posts)Discovery will be MOST INTERESTING. We'll also get to see the coordination between CORRUPT DWS, THE DNC and HRH's campaign through emails. It's going to be enlightening.
PEACE
LOVE
BERNIE
jwirr
(39,215 posts)agreed that there should be a full audit. She cannot back out now. He asked for the full audit from October when they reported the breach until now.
I hope he does not lift the suit until that is done.
draa
(975 posts)It's going to be fun if a judge gives Sanders' campaign full access to the DNC files. Stock up on popcorn because it's going to be a blast.
NYC Liberal
(20,136 posts)stealing from Sanders' voter database, and then the Clinton campaign tried to blame Sanders for it.
And if the DNC chair isn't too fond of Sanders, well, I don't blame her one bit. Sanders just joined the party a few months ago only after he decided he wanted to be president and needed the party's fundraising apparatus after spending years attacking the DNC and other Democrats, and even calling for the incumbent Democratic president to be thrown out in the last election.
Hillary is attacked as an "opportunist" and a "triangulator" but it's really Sanders who is both. Sanders wants it both ways: he wants the fundraising apparatus and support of The Establishment (DNC) for his campaign, but he also wants to claim to be oh-so pure and indepdendent, and be seen as the "anti-establishment" candidate.
treestar
(82,383 posts)What happened to all the boasting about Bernie getting his funds only from The People? The DNC is part of The Establishment. Good point on the hypocrisy.
Duval
(4,280 posts)Duval
(4,280 posts)don't say stuff like this.
NYC Liberal
(20,136 posts)The purpose of running in an election is to win, i.e., defeat your opponent. By definition, Sanders called for Obama to be defeated in the primary elections in 2012 even though he recognized there was no way that was going to happen.
Chef Eric
(1,024 posts)Don't you know that Sanders fired three staffers who accessed Clinton's data? Didn't you watch the debate, and see Sanders apologize to Clinton for what his staffers did?
There has not been any blame directed toward Clinton, and your post makes no sense.
uponit7771
(90,347 posts)Tarc
(10,476 posts)Having lost the real argument (people in his org did something wrong and were sanctioned appropriately) , they now fall back on if-wishes-were-kisses ones?
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)But this black & white version doesn't seem to want to stick.
Why is that?
Well, for one, its very uncharacteristic of Sanders and his way of doing things.... for decades now....
and second... the deep rooted nepotism on the Clinton side that was exposed by it is really more interesting than what was actually done. That sticks more than a staffer or two's foolish mistakes.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Her job is to win as many elections as possible.
Bernie needs more voters to win. He doesn't have as much support as Hillary among Democrats. The solution is to campaign, not blame the DNC chair because he's not winning.
madville
(7,412 posts)In that case, whatever she has been doing or advocates for we should be doing the opposite of. Since 2010, with the exception of the 2012 Presidency, that job performance has been an utter failure.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)I'm told she was not in fact very loyal and reached out to Obama while still working for Hillary but the optics suggest a certain degree of publicly stated loyalty. Do you co-chair campaigns for those to whom you are not loyal? I don't.
Uncle Joe
(58,366 posts)Thanks for the thread, cali.
urbuddha
(363 posts)I guess I will vote Green if Bernie doesn't win, but I am going to do everything
I possibly can to put him in the White House.
riversedge
(70,242 posts)AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)Yeah... well, that's a supernatural fantasy from a rather overworked movie from the late 70's so.... great!
riversedge
(70,242 posts)Yoda ?@yoda 22h22 hours ago
Just vote for the Force you all must do. Hrrrrrm.
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)Only in galaxy far far away.
riversedge
(70,242 posts)LiberalLovinLug
(14,174 posts)KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)it's all you have.
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)We have an honest candidate and campaign staff. These are people who don't have the DNC and all their little cheerleaders attached to HRC's every next step.
Anything else is myopic and a self-fulfilled prophecy.
riversedge
(70,242 posts)Hillary for Iowa Retweeted
Iowa Starting Line ?@IAStartingLine Dec 19
I mean, the Hillary campaign has already shown their allegiance to Star Wars light sabers #MayTheForceBeWithYou
gulliver
(13,186 posts)And it is a promise not to do it again. How can any Sanders supporter fail to follow his lead and not adopt an apologetic attitude toward Clinton? Not doing that is blaming the victim. Inventing a pretext for abusing the victim (biased loyalists in the woodwork!) is paranoid and kind of what the Republicans suffer from more than we usually do as liberals.
Sheepshank
(12,504 posts)all round cluster fuck
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)The Clinton campaign has a long and storied history of sleazy tactics ("hardworking white voters" .
I'm tired of it, so I won't condone it or ignore it.
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)"Yes, I apologize," he said on stage when asked by ABC's David Muir whether Clinton was owed an apology. "Not only do I apologize, I want to apologize to my supporters. This is not the kind of campaign that we run. If I find anybody else involved in this, they will be fired."
postatomic
(1,771 posts)It was Senator Sanders that decided to run as a Democrat. It is Senator Sanders who has been bashing the DNC every opportunity he gets. It was the Sanders Campaign that pulled that little 'dog and pony' show at the the Iowa JJ Dinner. It is Senator Sanders who has done nothing to gain support from other Democrats in office.
The only loyalty the DNC has is to the Democratic Party.
Current 538 Endorsement Numbers:
Clinton 455 - Sanders 2 - O'Malley 1
http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-endorsement-primary/
Your imaginary scenario would only be less-imaginary if Sanders actually decided to work with the DNC and court Democrats in office that could help him gain voters. Sanders wants to be a one-man show and gets annoyed when anyone pokes that little bubble of his.
still_one
(92,219 posts)the Bernie campaign was inappropriately obtained and downloaded from those in the Clinton camp.
Ikonoklast
(23,973 posts)Out of the blue.
Funny how that happened.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Where is the respect due her!
Ivan Kaputski
(528 posts)Ikonoklast
(23,973 posts)Especially when she convinces President Hillary Clinton that supporting Republican candidates in state elections will further her right-wing agenda, and make Wall Street even more powerful that they ever were
And to those of you who think DWS hasn't already been promised a high position in a Hillary administration, think again. That fix was in a loooong time ago.
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)Rigging the game makes the party look bad.
SCantiGOP
(13,871 posts)Le Taz Hot
(22,271 posts)suspension of all brain activity.