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merrily

(45,251 posts)
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 09:08 AM Aug 2015

Good ole NPR: "Exactly what kind of socialist is Bernie Sanders?"

http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2015/08/27/434872755/exactly-what-kind-of-socialist-is-bernie-sanders

The kind who wants Medicare for all and more humane Social Security, motherfuckers!

See also: http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/aug/26/bernie-sanders-socialist-or-democratic-socialist/

The NPR article is not that bad:

"It's a relatively mild, I would say a vanilla socialism," Nelson said Sanders told them. "It's basically focused on big businesses, and capitalist inequalities."

Eric Davis, a retired Middlebury College political scientist, agrees.

"In Western Europe, these are mainstream political parties that are in and out of government all the time," he said.

Of course, Sanders is not running for president of Sweden. And for many U.S. voters, socialist sounds a lot like communist.



The bad news for the red baiters: 47% of Americans polled (ALL parties, mind you) would have no problem voting for a straight up socialist AND more young voters approve of socialism than approve of capitalism.

Deal with it!



41 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Good ole NPR: "Exactly what kind of socialist is Bernie Sanders?" (Original Post) merrily Aug 2015 OP
K and R. Like it when you get *fiesty*. Smarmie Doofus Aug 2015 #1
Thanks. I have a feeling you ain't seen nuthin' yet. merrily Aug 2015 #2
I love how socialism is not a bad word anymore, except in the MSM and among the "elite" Hydra Aug 2015 #3
There will be nonstop red-baiting once Bernie gets more attention navarth Aug 2015 #4
Have you seen this thread by any chance? merrily Aug 2015 #12
oh that's helpful. need to bookmark for future reference. thanks! nt navarth Aug 2015 #14
There are some others around in GD, but obviously, I knew how to find that one. merrily Aug 2015 #15
So were Albert Einstein, and Rev. Martin Luther King. Fuddnik Aug 2015 #21
Does that not mean that 53 percent would not vote for a Socialist? oberliner Aug 2015 #5
Not necessarily. merrily Aug 2015 #11
Fair enough oberliner Aug 2015 #20
I have not supported NPR for a long time now. But I really do not think jwirr Aug 2015 #6
Unless you are over 50 years old, or listened to a lot of right wing media fbc Aug 2015 #9
And, if you are over 50, you probably remember a Democratic Party that was not so merrily Aug 2015 #23
Believe it or not I am 70 years old but I never fell for thier red baiting jwirr Aug 2015 #35
The kind that's not a corporatist, like the ones Doctor_J Aug 2015 #7
He's a Sewer Socialist fbc Aug 2015 #8
Hillary? .. Is that you calling Bernie shithead? Trajan Aug 2015 #26
Read the wiki page. I consider "sewer socialist" to be a compliment. fbc Aug 2015 #27
I think it is now, but it originally was an insult--coming from the left, not the right. eridani Aug 2015 #39
well said fbc Aug 2015 #41
AFAIC It's National Petroleum Radio's way RoccoR5955 Aug 2015 #10
Well at least they are talking about him instead of Trump. zeemike Aug 2015 #13
Kicked and recommended! Enthusiast Aug 2015 #16
I quit listening to NPR when they became cheerleaders for Bush's Iraq War in 2003. jalan48 Aug 2015 #17
NPR is the reason people take antidepressants olddots Aug 2015 #18
NPR = "News Propaganda for Republicans" KansDem Aug 2015 #19
Cokie Roberts criticized Obama for going to Hawaii when everyone was claiming he merrily Aug 2015 #24
That one lives in her own little aristocratic world. Fuddnik Aug 2015 #28
Yet, every talking head show has her on, representing the LEFT. Stacked deck. merrily Aug 2015 #31
Between Dopie, uh, Cokie and the snark of Steve Inskeep SoapBox Aug 2015 #30
Someone needs to drag NPR out of the red baiting 'fifties and into this century. 7 out of 10 Young sabrina 1 Aug 2015 #22
Nailed it, as you so often do, sabrina 1. merrily Aug 2015 #25
well said fbc Aug 2015 #29
as a jilted former lover of NPR, I never miss an opportunity to rec an anti NPR thread corkhead Aug 2015 #32
Americans have been told "Capitalism = Freedom"..... Spitfire of ATJ Aug 2015 #33
Capitalism = debtors' prisons. merrily Aug 2015 #34
Very true! Its the reason why China has finally embraced it d_legendary1 Aug 2015 #36
A generation that sees the financial sector devastate the economy Babel_17 Aug 2015 #37
Or not so new ideas that worked, but were abandoned because...corporatism. merrily Aug 2015 #40
Neutered Poodles for Republicans central scrutinizer Aug 2015 #38

Hydra

(14,459 posts)
3. I love how socialism is not a bad word anymore, except in the MSM and among the "elite"
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 09:38 AM
Aug 2015

It's a tribute to how badly capitialism is failing most people. Maybe we'll actually see the day when it gets trash binned.

navarth

(5,927 posts)
4. There will be nonstop red-baiting once Bernie gets more attention
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 09:56 AM
Aug 2015

Once he wins some primaries, he'll become really dangerous.

It is to be hoped that Bernie, his campaign, and we the supporters will be ready.

I'm already bugged that the media (including the compromised NPR) say socialist when Bernie describes himself as a Democratic Socialist. That difference is going to need some emphasis and I am among those who need to get better informed about it so I can have intelligent discussion about it when confronted with low-information voters.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
12. Have you seen this thread by any chance?
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 10:40 AM
Aug 2015
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12806844#post60

One person who should never have posted in the Sanders Group posted on it. Aside from that post, the replies are pretty good.

I especially like the one from a found of the USA Democratic Socialist movement.

Fun Fact: Orwell, author of 1984, was a Democratic Socialist. Not exactly a "commie," not that there's anything wrong with that.

Also:
Einstein predicted that under such a capitalist society, political parties and politicians would be corrupted by financial contributions made by owners of large capital amounts,[3] and the system "cannot be effectively checked even by a democratically organized political society"
.

And that would be Albert. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Why_Socialism%3F

merrily

(45,251 posts)
15. There are some others around in GD, but obviously, I knew how to find that one.
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 10:48 AM
Aug 2015

I especially like the reply of the poster who said focus on programs, not labels, or words to that effect.

This might help you, too, because many Americans seem to enjoy being in the majority: http://www.democraticunderground.com/12777036

Bernie's record is right in line with the majority of Americans, and then some.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
5. Does that not mean that 53 percent would not vote for a Socialist?
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 10:10 AM
Aug 2015

The 47 percent figure doesn't seem like a positive. I bet it was higher in years past.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
11. Not necessarily.
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 10:30 AM
Aug 2015

I don't really know much about the poll. For instance, was the question would you vote for a socialist for President if he or she were the nominee of the Democratic Party. For all I know--and I don't know much--people polled may have perceived it as a third party type question. Remember, too, that people of all political persuasions were polled and Bernie is not actually a socialist anyway. Besides, Bernie said that figure would go up before his campaign is over and I totally believe it.

The issue is not really whether people would vote for a socialist, but whether people would vote for Sanders if he were the Democratic nominee for POTUS, isn't it? And in match ups against Republicans, he does just fine.

BTW: Don't know if you noticed, but this is the Bernie Sanders Group.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
20. Fair enough
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 11:46 AM
Aug 2015

Nothing but support for Bernie Sanders - I just didn't find that poll to be especially encouraging.

I think Sanders would do quite well as the nominee - especially given the buffoonery on the Republican side.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
6. I have not supported NPR for a long time now. But I really do not think
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 10:15 AM
Aug 2015

this is going to be a big issue. The country is in big trouble and has been for some time. The people are aware of it and that is why they are coming to the meetings to find out what is going on and what we can do about it. I do not see any other candidate that actually has been talking about the issues.

They come to hear about that issues. And he gives them what they want. And at this point I do not think anyone is even thinking about socialism in any form.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
9. Unless you are over 50 years old, or listened to a lot of right wing media
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 10:29 AM
Aug 2015

You probably weren't indoctrinated with a fear of the word socialism.

For younger people, whose main exposure to the word has been the labeling of Obama and Obamacare, it's actually a positive term.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
23. And, if you are over 50, you probably remember a Democratic Party that was not so
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 11:56 AM
Aug 2015

corporatist.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
35. Believe it or not I am 70 years old but I never fell for thier red baiting
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 12:42 PM
Aug 2015

idiocy. But you are correct - many people over 50 did not know the difference between communism and socialism and sure as heck did not know there was such a thing as democratic socialism.

I am extremely glad that the young voters are not so easily led as that. One reason we were easily led is that back then we had politicians that we actually thought we could trust. And many of them were honest. Nothing like today.

eridani

(51,907 posts)
39. I think it is now, but it originally was an insult--coming from the left, not the right.
Fri Aug 28, 2015, 03:00 AM
Aug 2015

Eugene Debs used the term to criticize socialists who actually got elected, and found themselves having to deal with lots and lots of the specifics of governing. Debs said something like "They are more interested in cleaning the streets than in marching on them." Guess what? When you govern, people care about whether the streets are clean and a bunch of other picky little things that always come up in daily life.

 

RoccoR5955

(12,471 posts)
10. AFAIC It's National Petroleum Radio's way
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 10:29 AM
Aug 2015

of marginalizing Bernie.
Personally, I am getting sick and tired of all this "socialist" crap.
Do they know that the de facto business model here in the capitalist republic of the US is not a democracy, as they think, but it is a freakin' dictatorship? Perhaps we should be calling the business leaders, not entrepreneurs, but dictators!

Do they know that we have many aspects of our current "democracy" that are socialist? Like the military. But NOOOO, don't tell them that their beloved military is socialist. Don't tell them that anything in the so called democracy of the US is socialist, even though we are quite socialist.

And don't get me started on the "American Exceptionalism" crap. Yeah, Americans are exceptional. Many are exceptional idiots. (no intent to insult idiots).

zeemike

(18,998 posts)
13. Well at least they are talking about him instead of Trump.
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 10:42 AM
Aug 2015

But I lost faith in NPR and PBS years ago when they were co oped by big money.

jalan48

(13,865 posts)
17. I quit listening to NPR when they became cheerleaders for Bush's Iraq War in 2003.
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 11:09 AM
Aug 2015

Besides that their broadcasters put me to sleep with their, soft, cool and hip delivery.

KansDem

(28,498 posts)
19. NPR = "News Propaganda for Republicans"
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 11:41 AM
Aug 2015

I haven't listened to NPR since Cokie Roberts reported on the "Bush Charm Offensive" during the 2000 campaign.

Oh, and more Americans wanted to have a beer with George than with Al.

Oh, oh, and George gave out nicknames, too.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
24. Cokie Roberts criticized Obama for going to Hawaii when everyone was claiming he
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 12:01 PM
Aug 2015

was a foreigner because Hawaii was "exotic." His grandmother was dying, but that did not faze Cokie.

SoapBox

(18,791 posts)
30. Between Dopie, uh, Cokie and the snark of Steve Inskeep
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 12:12 PM
Aug 2015

I stopped listening. I was so damned mad one morning, listening on a dog walk, that I almost smashed my "Walkman" on the sidewalk...never went back to listening.

But...as Bernie's audience grows and with social media...maybe we can finally give NPR an earful!

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
22. Someone needs to drag NPR out of the red baiting 'fifties and into this century. 7 out of 10 Young
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 11:54 AM
Aug 2015

People WANT a Socialist Democratic Govt because they have way more information on what that means due to being able to access more information and because of travel etc. No longer dependent on propaganda they are not influenced by the old and fading, diminishing Cold Warriors who haven't left them much of a legacy for THEIR future, another thing they are aware of.

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
33. Americans have been told "Capitalism = Freedom".....
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 12:28 PM
Aug 2015

The people who say that the loudest also were screaming about Iraq being behind 9/11.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
34. Capitalism = debtors' prisons.
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 12:34 PM
Aug 2015

We don't do that anymore, but we still do corporate welfare and for profit prisons.

d_legendary1

(2,586 posts)
36. Very true! Its the reason why China has finally embraced it
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 01:53 PM
Aug 2015

in 1978. Much easier to keep the people in control if they owe the state.

Babel_17

(5,400 posts)
37. A generation that sees the financial sector devastate the economy
Thu Aug 27, 2015, 05:28 PM
Aug 2015

A generation that sees the financial sector devastate the economy tends to become more open minded to new ideas regarding governance.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
40. Or not so new ideas that worked, but were abandoned because...corporatism.
Fri Aug 28, 2015, 07:57 AM
Aug 2015

Either way, I'm ready for Bernie!

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