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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

DanTex

(20,709 posts)
Thu Dec 12, 2019, 11:32 PM Dec 2019

The whole "it takes a socialist to beat a crazy guy" theory just took a pretty big hit in the UK.

I'm not saying I know the magic formula for defeating crazy right-wingers. I wish I did, and I will vigorously back the Dem nominee no matter who it is.

But the theory I've heard many times, that if only we run a real left-winger instead of a "neoliberal corporatist third-wayer" then the "white working class" will flock to us, sure didn't work out for the Brits.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
33 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The whole "it takes a socialist to beat a crazy guy" theory just took a pretty big hit in the UK. (Original Post) DanTex Dec 2019 OP
The formula would have been 1) not a Socialist 2) advocating a hard Remain position brooklynite Dec 2019 #1
I think the winning strategy would have been the softest brexit possible Amishman Dec 2019 #27
We have not been "brits".... JoeOtterbein Dec 2019 #2
Exactly. TidalWave46 Dec 2019 #24
No one is arguing we are Brits. I don't expect anyone to do so anytime soon. LanternWaste Dec 2019 #31
lol.. that didn't fly before the big Loss by corbyn. Cha Dec 2019 #3
Corbyn evertonfc Dec 2019 #4
The big question for me is.. why Cha Dec 2019 #8
Because the Labour members elect the leader Otto Lidenbrock Dec 2019 #20
Wow.. thanks for that Cha Dec 2019 #22
Yes he is,the sucker Wellstone ruled Dec 2019 #9
that would be anecdotal evidence NJCher Dec 2019 #5
Labour gained 32 seats under Corbyn in 2017 ritapria Dec 2019 #6
Corbyn is generally unpopular in the UK. The Brexit vote solidified behind Johnson, but the lutherj Dec 2019 #7
Corbyn's meddling in internal affairs of India over Kashmir NYMinute Dec 2019 #11
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2019 #14
Nice try . . . . lutherj Dec 2019 #23
+1,000,000 nt NYMinute Dec 2019 #10
Time to end the flirtations with populism worldwide, right and left. The Valley Below Dec 2019 #12
But the conservative party in the UK videohead5 Dec 2019 #13
I'm not supporting Sanders for the nomination but he is a way better man than Corbyn. phleshdef Dec 2019 #15
Hillary lost to trump. nt RandiFan1290 Dec 2019 #16
Hillary was not a "neoliberal corporatist third-wayer." betsuni Dec 2019 #17
Hillary lost to Trump because videohead5 Dec 2019 #18
Long list of excuses. nt RandiFan1290 Dec 2019 #19
Excuses? betsuni Dec 2019 #28
I suspect we'll be hearing plenty of those from Sanders supporters in the coming months BannonsLiver Dec 2019 #30
Post hoc ergo prompter hoc. LanternWaste Dec 2019 #32
If the Democrats move too far left, they will lose Gothmog Dec 2019 #21
Yup... BooScout Dec 2019 #25
+1000, DanTex. It confirms what honest analysts have been Hortensis Dec 2019 #26
Looks like it. (nt) ehrnst Dec 2019 #29
The NYT has some great comments on this Gothmog Dec 2019 #33
 

brooklynite

(94,723 posts)
1. The formula would have been 1) not a Socialist 2) advocating a hard Remain position
Thu Dec 12, 2019, 11:33 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Amishman

(5,559 posts)
27. I think the winning strategy would have been the softest brexit possible
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 08:35 AM
Dec 2019

Brexit in name only, fulfil the letter of the brexit referendum but not the spirit. After the referendum, they should have shifted to softening the blow as much as possible and not defying the vote.

On non brexit, focus on fixing healthcare (sound familiar?)

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

JoeOtterbein

(7,702 posts)
2. We have not been "brits"....
Thu Dec 12, 2019, 11:38 PM
Dec 2019

...since 1776. I don't expect it to become so anytime soon.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

TidalWave46

(2,061 posts)
24. Exactly.
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 08:21 AM
Dec 2019

Today, we would never seriously consider a socialist for our highest office. We aren’t the “Brits.” It would be suicide to do so.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
31. No one is arguing we are Brits. I don't expect anyone to do so anytime soon.
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 10:25 AM
Dec 2019

(I get it.. you're forced to argue against something no one has said because media/poor polling/name recognition. Tough old world, eh?)

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(297,595 posts)
3. lol.. that didn't fly before the big Loss by corbyn.
Thu Dec 12, 2019, 11:39 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

evertonfc

(1,713 posts)
4. Corbyn
Thu Dec 12, 2019, 11:45 PM
Dec 2019

was a smug, arrogant prick. He never stood a chance. The Brits just made thier bed- let em sleep in it.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(297,595 posts)
8. The big question for me is.. why
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 12:37 AM
Dec 2019

did Labour run him when they knew how unpopular Corbyn was?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Otto Lidenbrock

(581 posts)
20. Because the Labour members elect the leader
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 07:51 AM
Dec 2019

And the membership grew exponentially under Corbyn because he attracted new, young people into politics. Corbyn faced a leadership challenge in 2016 after his own MPs submitted a no confidence vote in him but he trounced his moderate challenger to keep his job.

The new young people tend to be in London or university towns which are already pro-Labour and most likely pro-EU. Corbyn and Labour lost seats in historically Labour towns when lifelong Labour voters switched to get brexit done.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(297,595 posts)
22. Wow.. thanks for that
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 08:01 AM
Dec 2019

synopsis, OL.

Good luck with Johnson, UK.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Wellstone ruled

(34,661 posts)
9. Yes he is,the sucker
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 12:44 AM
Dec 2019

is not liked by the average person on the street. Just a plain Jerk.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

NJCher

(35,722 posts)
5. that would be anecdotal evidence
Thu Dec 12, 2019, 11:47 PM
Dec 2019

you need a series of similar cases to make a point.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

ritapria

(1,812 posts)
6. Labour gained 32 seats under Corbyn in 2017
Thu Dec 12, 2019, 11:50 PM
Dec 2019

If the Brits hated Progressive Policies , he would have been crushed in 2017 ... He needed to take a stand on Brexit .. He decided not to decide ..He punted ..He lost

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lutherj

(2,496 posts)
7. Corbyn is generally unpopular in the UK. The Brexit vote solidified behind Johnson, but the
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 12:33 AM
Dec 2019

remainers split between Labour and Lib Dems. Corbyn was never clear about his position regarding Brexit, and many feel that he harbors Brexit sympathies. Moreover, he has faced accusations of anti-semitism — whether justified or not. To try to map the outcome of UK’s parliamentary election onto what’s going on in this country, or to compare Corbyn to Warren or Sanders, is apples and oranges in my opinion.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

NYMinute

(3,256 posts)
11. Corbyn's meddling in internal affairs of India over Kashmir
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 01:33 AM
Dec 2019

cost him the votes of Indians in UK who always voted labour and he lost nearly 35 seats over it.

He should have kept silent on India's stance in Kashmir.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

Response to lutherj (Reply #7)

 

lutherj

(2,496 posts)
23. Nice try . . . .
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 08:19 AM
Dec 2019

🤪

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

The Valley Below

(1,701 posts)
12. Time to end the flirtations with populism worldwide, right and left.
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 01:35 AM
Dec 2019

Populism bring nothing but chaos and human misery.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

videohead5

(2,181 posts)
13. But the conservative party in the UK
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 03:14 AM
Dec 2019

Is probably more liberal than some Democrats in the U.S..

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

phleshdef

(11,936 posts)
15. I'm not supporting Sanders for the nomination but he is a way better man than Corbyn.
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 05:07 AM
Dec 2019

Corbyn's problem isn't his ideology. Its the fact that he a shitty person.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

RandiFan1290

(6,242 posts)
16. Hillary lost to trump. nt
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 07:06 AM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

betsuni

(25,610 posts)
17. Hillary was not a "neoliberal corporatist third-wayer."
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 07:27 AM
Dec 2019

Neither was President Obama. Obviously.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

videohead5

(2,181 posts)
18. Hillary lost to Trump because
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 07:37 AM
Dec 2019

Of the letter Comey sent 11 days before the election. Some Democrats stayed at home and some voted third party. The Russians kept Trump close enough with their propaganda and Comey's letter pushed Trump over the finish line.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

RandiFan1290

(6,242 posts)
19. Long list of excuses. nt
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 07:40 AM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

betsuni

(25,610 posts)
28. Excuses?
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 08:39 AM
Dec 2019

"Some people say that if maybe that system was not rigged against me, I would have won the nomination and defeated Donald Trump."

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BannonsLiver

(16,448 posts)
30. I suspect we'll be hearing plenty of those from Sanders supporters in the coming months
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 09:16 AM
Dec 2019

As he loses yet another primary fight.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
32. Post hoc ergo prompter hoc.
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 10:25 AM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(145,530 posts)
21. If the Democrats move too far left, they will lose
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 07:53 AM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BooScout

(10,406 posts)
25. Yup...
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 08:22 AM
Dec 2019

And given the results of 2016, the Democrats could lose no matter what they do. Nothing is certain....but if the leftward shift doesn't show signs of moderating, the Democrats could be out in the cold for another 4 years.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
26. +1000, DanTex. It confirms what honest analysts have been
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 08:24 AM
Dec 2019

saying all along.

The electoral majority of mainstream Americans who elected Obama twice averages out moderate liberal, and most of our best primary candidates are, no surprise, running as moderate liberals. Even conservative blue dog Seth Moulton tailored his recent voting record to show moderate liberal ahead of his run for president.

The widespread, toxic portrayal of a Democratic Party swinging far left is a lie intended to defeat us by suppressing mainstream left turnout.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ehrnst

(32,640 posts)
29. Looks like it. (nt)
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 08:57 AM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(145,530 posts)
33. The NYT has some great comments on this
Sat Dec 14, 2019, 01:41 AM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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