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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 11:37 AM Dec 2019

Even with tax hikes and defense cuts, Sanders' plans would add to deficit

Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders’ policy proposals could cost more than $60 trillion over a decade and if enacted would likely add significantly to annual federal deficits and the national debt.

snip===================================================================

Sanders has put forward proposals — including a wealth tax, reversing tax cuts and a financial transactions tariff — he says will help pay for his social programs, without adding to the deficit and the national debt, but economists say his plans won’t raise enough.

snip===================================================================

The Sanders team says these taxes will raise nearly $10 trillion over 10 years, well short of the total amount of spending Sanders is envisioning, likely meaning the additional cost will be added to federal deficits over the years.

snip===================================================================

The Sanders campaign did not respond to multiple requests for comment for this story.

*****************************************************************************************





https://vtdigger.org/2019/12/29/even-with-tax-hikes-and-defense-cuts-sanders-plans-would-add-to-deficit/

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
43 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Even with tax hikes and defense cuts, Sanders' plans would add to deficit (Original Post) lapucelle Dec 2019 OP
Right on schedule, here come people screaming about deficits when Dems propose new policies. LonePirate Dec 2019 #1
Is there anything inaccurate about the content of that OP? George II Dec 2019 #3
It is a stealth Repub talking point. There are never deficit concerns when Repub propose policies. LonePirate Dec 2019 #26
Here you are again accusing Dems of Cha Jan 2020 #40
Wait...what? VT Digger is "screaming" about deficits? lapucelle Dec 2019 #6
It's not honest journalism when only one party is subjected to deficit concerns. LonePirate Dec 2019 #27
VT Digger is a local news source covering a local politician who is running for president. lapucelle Dec 2019 #30
Do you think local news sources never perpetuate right wing talking points? LonePirate Dec 2019 #31
This news story is not "perpetuating right wing talking points", and VT Digger lapucelle Dec 2019 #32
Attacking positions on the left (but not on the right) with deficit concerns is indeed a RW point. LonePirate Dec 2019 #33
The news article is not an "attack". Its purpose is to inform and its tone is objective. lapucelle Dec 2019 #34
What makes it an attack is when only side's positions are subject to such an critical eye. LonePirate Dec 2019 #35
News coverage of a presidential candidate's policy proposal isn't an attack. lapucelle Dec 2019 #37
It is not objective journalism when the info is disseminated with a partisan method or motive! LonePirate Dec 2019 #38
The VT Digger story is not partisan in either method or motive. N/T lapucelle Dec 2019 #39
And, that's the last damn word Cha Jan 2020 #41
wow llashram Dec 2019 #2
I am not surprised by this Gothmog Dec 2019 #4
If so, worth it. David__77 Dec 2019 #5
I should hope so BeyondGeography Dec 2019 #7
I wonder where he proposes to get that additional $55 trillion? There are no trillionaires in the US George II Dec 2019 #8
Maybe ask the Pentagon if they can find some of the money they lost. vsrazdem Dec 2019 #9
First, if true that's not even half. Second, it's not true: George II Dec 2019 #22
Right, cause they don't waste money. vsrazdem Dec 2019 #23
They certainly didn't waste 2-1/2 to 3 times their entire budget. George II Dec 2019 #24
Unfortunately, I think Warren's proposals would add even more to deficit/debt. Hoyt Dec 2019 #10
E Warren was honest in her analysis and discussion of costs. lapucelle Dec 2019 #12
Not really. Her first estimate on MFA was $2.1 Trillion less per year than her latest estimate. Hoyt Dec 2019 #15
Revising an appraisal of costs is an honest thing to do. lapucelle Dec 2019 #18
It wasn't honest at all dansolo Dec 2019 #25
She's not an economist. Asserting an attempt to "bamboozle with rediculous lapucelle Dec 2019 #28
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2019 #11
My goodness...you sound angry. lapucelle Dec 2019 #13
Hi...... Bye....... George II Dec 2019 #17
Yeah, sounds like the poster couldn't handle the truth.. Cha Dec 2019 #36
welcome to DU gopiscrap Dec 2019 #14
but not for long. marble falls Dec 2019 #16
Thanks for this much needed dose of reality, lapucelle. R B Garr Dec 2019 #19
No surprise. highplainsdem Dec 2019 #20
Articles like this are really valuable in no way... TidalWave46 Dec 2019 #21
Sure, most of us here know these policies will never happen, but it's important to point that out maximusveritas Jan 2020 #43
K&R! nt TexasTowelie Dec 2019 #29
K&R betsuni Jan 2020 #42
 

LonePirate

(13,431 posts)
1. Right on schedule, here come people screaming about deficits when Dems propose new policies.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 11:41 AM
Dec 2019

Yet these people never seem to care about deficits when Republicans cause or grow them.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
3. Is there anything inaccurate about the content of that OP?
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 11:49 AM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,431 posts)
26. It is a stealth Repub talking point. There are never deficit concerns when Repub propose policies.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 02:44 PM
Dec 2019

Talk about deficits with regard to Dem policies but never mention deficits when talking about Repub policies. It is a long-standing rinse and repeat cycle which DUers should not support or encourage but some, nevertheless, do.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Cha

(297,818 posts)
40. Here you are again accusing Dems of
Wed Jan 1, 2020, 04:32 AM
Jan 2020

posting "republican talking points".

Still not working.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
6. Wait...what? VT Digger is "screaming" about deficits?
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 11:57 AM
Dec 2019

And what's this stuff about "schedules"? Journalist Kit Norton seems like an objective local reporter based on his stories.

https://vtdigger.org/author/kit-norton/

Although some politicians might have a problem with honest, hard-hitting coverage by the local press, that's no reason to diminish and demonize honest journalism.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/02/26/ive-reported-bernie-sanders-years-free-press-cant-give-him-what-he-wants/

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,431 posts)
27. It's not honest journalism when only one party is subjected to deficit concerns.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 02:49 PM
Dec 2019

Granted, none of VT’s three federally elected officials are Republicans. Still, neither local or national press members, blogs, etc. seem to care about deficits when it comes to Republican policies. It’s always those on the left who face that criticism.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
30. VT Digger is a local news source covering a local politician who is running for president.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 03:16 PM
Dec 2019

What exactly is "dishonest" about that? The story gives an honest outline of the candidate's positions over the years and provides links to reliable sources, including the CBO, the Urban Institute, the New Yorker, WaPo, and BS's own official .gov page and his official YouTube channel.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,431 posts)
31. Do you think local news sources never perpetuate right wing talking points?
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 03:22 PM
Dec 2019

Local talk radio hosts do it all of the time, so why do you think local journalists don’t do it?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
32. This news story is not "perpetuating right wing talking points", and VT Digger
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 03:36 PM
Dec 2019

is a reliable news source that is committed to journalistic best practices.

https://ja3ga476chj1nc6csy2j81c7-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/VTDigger-2018-Annual-Report-1.pdf

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,431 posts)
33. Attacking positions on the left (but not on the right) with deficit concerns is indeed a RW point.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 03:51 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
34. The news article is not an "attack". Its purpose is to inform and its tone is objective.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 04:03 PM
Dec 2019

Mischaracterizing a fact-based informative news article as an "attack" does not make it one.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,431 posts)
35. What makes it an attack is when only side's positions are subject to such an critical eye.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 04:27 PM
Dec 2019

Fairness is reviewing positions on the left and the right with the same critical eye. Only positions on the left are ever subjected to these deficit concerns. This is common practice for much of the media and press. They question left wing positions with regard to the deficit but they (except for Krugman of The New York Times) never question right wing positions in the same manner. When one side is subjected to a critical review while the other side is given a free pass, that’s an attack or a right wing talking point, in this instance. These one sided critiques are all performed for the same purpose - to diminish support for the position. The motive behind the critique is as serious a problem as the one sidedness of the critique. I am amazed how so few DUers are able to recognize this right wing strategy and the willing (hapless?) participants who push this strategy for them.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
37. News coverage of a presidential candidate's policy proposal isn't an attack.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 04:44 PM
Dec 2019

Accusing journalists of being "hapless participants" in the dissemination of objective information from a variety of reliable sources with the purpose of educating voters (as if the motive is somehow suspect because the data fails to confirm someone's biases) seems problematic at best.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,431 posts)
38. It is not objective journalism when the info is disseminated with a partisan method or motive!
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 04:55 PM
Dec 2019

How many times do I have to repeat that criticizing only left wing positions with deficit concerns is a highly partisan and right wing propaganda tactic or attack?

Think of it this way. Let’s say you witness someone stealing a pack of gum from a check out line. Then you see a second person doing the same thing. However, you inform the clerk or the manager about only one of the incidents and you let the other one slide without mentioning a word. That is akin to what the press or the media does when they review left wing policies for deficit concerns but they never review right wing positions for the same deficit concerns. Again, why is this double standard so difficult for DUers to recognize?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
39. The VT Digger story is not partisan in either method or motive. N/T
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 05:07 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(297,818 posts)
41. And, that's the last damn word
Wed Jan 1, 2020, 04:35 AM
Jan 2020

on that!

2020!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

llashram

(6,265 posts)
2. wow
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 11:45 AM
Dec 2019

seems like correct math. No real-world savings are evident.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(145,668 posts)
4. I am not surprised by this
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 11:52 AM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

David__77

(23,558 posts)
5. If so, worth it.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 11:53 AM
Dec 2019

I certainly don’t think austerity should be the guideline.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
8. I wonder where he proposes to get that additional $55 trillion? There are no trillionaires in the US
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 12:18 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

vsrazdem

(2,177 posts)
9. Maybe ask the Pentagon if they can find some of the money they lost.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 12:23 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

vsrazdem

(2,177 posts)
23. Right, cause they don't waste money.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 02:01 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
24. They certainly didn't waste 2-1/2 to 3 times their entire budget.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 02:25 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
10. Unfortunately, I think Warren's proposals would add even more to deficit/debt.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 12:42 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
12. E Warren was honest in her analysis and discussion of costs.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 12:55 PM
Dec 2019

All candidates should be.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
15. Not really. Her first estimate on MFA was $2.1 Trillion less per year than her latest estimate.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 01:02 PM
Dec 2019

And she was forced to perform her latest projection because no one believed what she was saying.

Sanders, at least, says our taxes will go up. Warren says only the wealthy will pay for all her promises. Ain't gonna happen, not to mention she will need a lot of million/billionaires to fund everything.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
18. Revising an appraisal of costs is an honest thing to do.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 01:20 PM
Dec 2019

As for being "forced to perform her latest projection because no one believed what she was saying" ...

Well, that certainly is an interesting characterization.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

dansolo

(5,376 posts)
25. It wasn't honest at all
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 02:28 PM
Dec 2019

She tried to bamboozle everyone with rediculous numbers. She only updated them when people showed that they were completely unrealistic. If she was such a brilliant economist, why were her numbers so far off in the first place?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
28. She's not an economist. Asserting an attempt to "bamboozle with rediculous
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 02:55 PM
Dec 2019

numbers" is such an interesting (albeit unsupported) aspersion.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

Response to lapucelle (Original post)

 

lapucelle

(18,362 posts)
13. My goodness...you sound angry.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 12:57 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

George II

(67,782 posts)
17. Hi...... Bye.......
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 01:13 PM
Dec 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(297,818 posts)
36. Yeah, sounds like the poster couldn't handle the truth..
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 04:34 PM
Dec 2019

or reality.. too bad

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

R B Garr

(16,996 posts)
19. Thanks for this much needed dose of reality, lapucelle.
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 01:21 PM
Dec 2019

K&R!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

TidalWave46

(2,061 posts)
21. Articles like this are really valuable in no way...
Tue Dec 31, 2019, 01:36 PM
Dec 2019

And are even a bit detached from reality.

Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders’ policy proposals could cost more than $60 trillion over a decade and if enacted would likely add significantly to annual federal deficits and the national debt.


It is no secret that one of Sanders greatest weaknesses is his inability to get legislation passed or to even form a legislatively meaningful coalition. With Turner or Gray as his COS that aspect would only become worse under a Sanders Presidency.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

maximusveritas

(2,915 posts)
43. Sure, most of us here know these policies will never happen, but it's important to point that out
Wed Jan 1, 2020, 11:41 PM
Jan 2020

so he can't get away with making these false promises of magically doing all these things and fooling people into voting for him. This is what hurt Warren when the media started asking her for the numbers behind her Medicare for All. For some reason, Bernie never gets asked to show his math.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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