Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumPete Buttigieg just got his best national poll so far
Buttigieg just scored his highest Democratic primary national poll number to date at 4% of Democrats and Democratic leaning registered voters, according to Quinnipiac University. That easily beats his old high of 1% in a live interview national poll. A jump of 3 points may not seem like a lot, but, because the margin of error shrinks significantly the closer you get to 0, the move from 1% to 4% is likely statistically significant.
Former Vice President Joe Biden continues to lead the Democratic field in the Quinnipiac poll at 29%, with Sen. Bernie Sanders at 19%, former US Rep. Beto O'Rourke at 12% and Sen. Kamala Harris in fourth at 8%.
Buttigieg's standing lands him at fifth and tied with Sen. Elizabeth Warren. Buttigieg is ahead of both Sens. Cory Booker and Amy Klobuchar, who are each at 2%. In other words, the current mayor of South Bend, Indiana, is polling in the same area as a number of candidates who are regarded as having a legitimate chance of winning the Democratic nomination.
https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/28/politics/pete-buttigieg-best-national-poll-so-far/index.html?utm_source=twCNNp&utm_medium=social&utm_term=image&utm_content=2019-03-28T10%3A54%3A01
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
doompatrol39
(428 posts)...that he's been able to jump that much, that quickly. I was one of the people who figured that the mayor of South Bend would be the absolute last person that would be able to do that among this crowded field. But the fact that he has shows just what a great candidate he is and what a good guy he is.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
True Dough
(17,327 posts)Let's keep this Mayor Pete momentum rolling!
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
still_one
(92,409 posts)saying she stood for nothing but just "attacking trump", as far as I am concerned he either wasn't paying attention to what the Democratic nominee was saying, or just wants to make headlines to attract the Hillary haters.
Buttigieg won't be one of the nominees I will be considering in the primaries
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Celerity
(43,532 posts)oh the irony
https://www.democraticunderground.com/128733687
That's Not What He Said! Mayor Pete / Hillary Clinton Edition
https://www.wonkette.com/thats-not-what-he-said-mayor-pete-hillary-clinton-edition
As we mentioned in our piece about Pete Buttigieg's interview on the Morning Joe Coffee Achievers Show of Shows, the mayor of South Bend, Indiana, also did an interview with Esquire magazine, published yesterday. And wouldn't you know it, the magazine's choice of a pull quote has led a whole bunch of people on Twitter to decide that Pete Buttigieg shat all over Hillary Clinton and everyone who supported her, so fuck him, that fucking entitled millennial piece of shit.
Twitter being Twitter, there is not a hell of a lot of nuance in the discussion. And that's why Yr Wonkette, just last week, inaugurated what we're afraid will have to be a regular feature during Campaign 2020: "That's Not What She/He Said," in which we take various chunks of the Dems In Disarray Narrative and give 'em a good hosing-down. So let's take a look at the idea that Pete Buttigieg is a snotty terrible man who trashed Hillary Clinton, shall we? We shall!
First up, one of several tweets accusing Buttigieg of just LOVING the glass ceiling and wanting to keep women in their place. (For those keeping score at home, this is actually the position we hope to debunk):
Link to tweet
Gosh, that DOES look terrible! And if it had been all he'd said, then it would be terrible. Except it's a pull quote that pulls the quote right out of any context. Here's the full question, and Buttigieg's answer, and we think the context matters more than a little:
snip
also here is the Esquire article in full
The Esquire Interview: Mayor Peter Buttigieg
The South Bend, Indiana mayor and Democratic presidential candidate talks socialism, the Green New Deal, "I'm With Her," what Democrats can learn from James Joyce(!), and more.
https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a26861236/peter-buttigieg-interview/
The more I see and learn about Mayor Pete the more I really really like
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
still_one
(92,409 posts)"We spent, I think, way too much time on our side talking about him," Buttigieg said in an interview with "The Breakfast Club," a New York City-based radio show, which ran Tuesday morning. "Our whole message was don't vote for him because he is terrible. And even because he is, that is not a message."
https://www.abc-7.com/story/40205413/pete-buttigieg-just-nailed-what-hillary-clinton-did-wrong-in-2016
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)How much time did we spend talking about how Trump sucks and obsessing over every tweet?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
still_one
(92,409 posts)Buttigieg misquoted, or did I misread what he actually said. I am not being facetious with that question
Regardless, if he is our nominee, I will back him 100%
On EDIT:
I see your point, the press misrepresented the point he was making. I got it.
Thanks
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
And I am sorry if I came on a little strong, too much coffee, eeeek
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
still_one
(92,409 posts)obviously his message is getting through based on the recent polls
Thanks
I am going to leave my original post since it will hopefully lead to others like me who are misinformed getting the facts correct from the respones
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
crazytown
(7,277 posts)and we spent too much time talking about him. Trump was throwing bombs day after day and Hillary was reported when she addressed it. The substantive message, what her presidency would mean for the nation got drowned out. Thats as I remember it.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)He's very good at messaging. O'Rourke is good too.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
femmedem
(8,207 posts)Buttigieg did not say Hillary did anything wrong. He said WE did.
This is exactly what the media does: they find the most inflammatory pull quote from a substantive interview, take it out of context, and turn that into the story.
I will say this: it's the media--and then posts like this that amplify the media's spin--that control what message the public ultimately hears. It's very, very hard for the candidate to have control over the message. And that's why I don't think he is blaming Clinton or saying she didn't stand for anything--and why so many of us are urging you to look more closely at Buttigieg's intent.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
still_one
(92,409 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TexasBushwhacker
(20,215 posts)Saying things like "basket of deplrables" didn't help her.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Against an opponent like Trump, backtracking is treated as a sign of weakness. He used it to fire up his base. When she first said it, it fired up her base. But then she dropped it rather than use it to fire us up further.
Please note: This is not a criticism of Hillary. She did what most politicians would do. She did the normal thing. But you can't act normally against Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
USALiberal
(10,877 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Celerity
(43,532 posts)Which isn't surprising coming from Chris Cillizza. Cillizza, btw, goes on (in the link you posted) to add his two cents in about Sec Clinton, which goes way beyond anything Buttigieg said, and shows his (Cillizza's) mindset and why he would latch onto that one quote:
Only 38% of people had a favorable opinion about Trump while 60% had an unfavorable one. Just one in three said Trump was honest and trustworthy. Less than four in 10 thought he was qualified to be president. Only 35% said Trump had the right temperament to be president. (All of these data points are from the 2016 exit polling.) Those sorts of numbers have "l-o-s-e-r" written all over them!
Except...
1) Clinton's numbers weren't much better. Just 43% had a favorable view of her and 36% thought she was honest and trustworthy. Those numbers sort-of canceled out Trump's own disastrous ratings.
2) People didn't care as much about liking their candidate as they did about that candidate bringing about what they believed to be needed change. Four in 10 voters said that a candidate who could create change was the most important trait in their choosing of a candidate; Trump won more than 80% of those voters.
That Trump was someone a majority of people didn't like, didn't trust and didn't think had the right temperament to be president wasn't enough. Many people may have agreed that, in Buttigieg's words, "he is terrible," but they also didn't like Clinton or have any idea what sort of change she might actually represent.
The message was simply: You're not going to vote for this guy, are you? And that wasn't enough.
Presidential elections, unlike midterm elections, traditionally require a candidate to make a case not only against the other side but for him or herself. (This is quite clearly not true in midterms when the party out of the White House can succeed by simply casting itself as a a check on the party in power.) Because Trump was so abnormal in terms of the traditional qualities of a presidential candidate, Clinton's team lost that thread -- and never got it back.
snip
There are many reasons we lost in 2016, many valid and played a role, some not valid. Buttigieg was highlighting just one of them, he has talked about many others as well and he has never went into an 'attack Clinton' mode like you tried to frame, he was speaking of the entire mindset of many Democrats as a whole.
here is the entire video from The Breakfast Club
and here is a more fully fleshed out part from that Esquire interview
Buttigieg was talking about the buttons, shirts, etc etc that were ubiquitous and using it as a partially comparative metaphor to fully answer the question.
here is the complete exchange
One of the hallmarks of the campaign so far has been a really rich and detailed debate about policy within the Democratic Party. Is that what's important right now? Or should the Democratic Party simply be organized around the simple premise that Donald Trump is a national emergency and must be defeated above all else and that the policy particulars should take a back seat to that?
Buttigieg:
So actually I don't agree with either of those approaches. The problem with making it all about him is that's what we did in 2016, and when we make it all about him, then there's a lot of voters in places like the industrial midwest, where I live, who say, "Okay, but who's talking about me?" Part of how we lost our way in 2016 was, first of all, it was all about our own nominee. "I'm with her," was literally the button.
Then when we realized who the Republican nominee was going to be, the message became, "Don't vote for him." And we just left a lot of people out because it didn't seem like we were talking about the lived experience of Americans.
For the same reason I don't think that we should do the usual Democratic thing, which is experiencing your competition through competing policy proposals. I think that policy matters, I'm a policy guy. But I think that you need our altitude to be both higher and lower. Higher in the sense that I think we need to talk about values and principles, that's why I'm out there talking about what freedom and democracy and security mean before we get into the depth of any policy idea. And at the same time also be talking in terms that are nearer to the ground, really explaining what we believe in in terms of everyday lived experience and how different under us it will be than under them. And that's how good political narrative works.
snip
Wonkette's take
So the context is not "Why do you hate Hillary Clinton and all the women who supported her," but rather "should Democrats focus on the threat of Donald Trump to the exclusion of all else?" AND ALSO "what should the role of policy arguments be in this election?" It's rather a lot. Notice that, in the discussion of how much to focus on Trump, most of his answer is about why making that the sole focus would be a bad idea. The bit about "I'm with her" is hardly the main point, but there it is, highlighted BY ESQUIRE in both the pull-quote (worse, in the middle of an unrelated question) and the freaking subhed, as if slagging Hillary had been Buttigieg's whole reason for doing the interview.
Watson (the tweet that I posted above) and others then disingenuously used the out-of-context, chopped 'quote' to falsely slag off Buttigeig via a false meme.
also Im With Her was from the campaign itself and was fully pushed by them
The Story Behind Im With Her
And three other iconic campaign designs from the Hillary Clinton campaign.
https://www.fastcompany.com/90109190/the-story-behind-im-with-her
At an event in March put on by the New York chapter of the professional design association AIGA and the design team for the Hillary Clinton Campaign, graphic designer Ida Woldemichael opened her speech with a bang. So youve all heard the phrase, Im With Her, yes? she asked, and then paused. The crowds strong applause seemed to suggest the answer was yes. I wrote that, she responded simply.
It wasnt a humble bragthe story that proceeded that statement, about how Woldemichael came up with Im With Her, illustrated the way that setting up a branding system for the campaign allowed for deliberate design decisions to be made even in the most harried of scenarios. Im With Her went from Woldemichaels sketchbook to a bumper sticker in a matter of days.
[Image: courtesy Hillary for America]
Yes, the phrase Im With Her was invented by a designer one random morning in the campaigns Brooklyn headquarters. It has since come out of so many mouths, been used in so many articles and hashtags, and been scrawled on so many signsand is generally so entrenched in our rhetoric about Hillary Clinton nowit was almost a surprise that it had any origin story at all.
Of course it doesall things do. And while the team of designers on the campaign couldnt have predicted it would take off to quite the degree it did, that lack of clear origin, or campaign ownership, was in some ways deliberate. Woldemichael described the teams strategy for un-designing certain campaign graphics so that supporters could fill them with their own meaning, in turn making them more likely to go viral. Our goal was not to be cool, she said at the event. It was to be accessible and even own-able.
snip
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
femmedem
(8,207 posts)I posted a reply, then saw that you had replied as I was searching for and listening to the Breakfast Club interview. So well put and well-sourced.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Celerity
(43,532 posts)tried to cherry-pick and slag off Pete over the same thing
I did go on to make another reply directly about the Chris Cillizza article, which was about The Breakfast Club interview
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
femmedem
(8,207 posts)He did not say "she stood for nothing but just attacking Trump." He said we (Democrats) spent too much time talking about Trump, thinking that if people realized how bad Trump is they wouldn't vote for him. He was talking about what we (Democrats generally, not Clinton specifically) emphasized in messaging. In no way did he badmouth Clinton or her platform. He goes on to say almost in the next breath that the Democratic agenda is the right agenda.
Yes, he did say, in the midst of this, that "our whole message was don't vote for him because he's terrible." And in isolation, it is easy to conclude from that snip that he was slamming Clinton for not standing for anything. But I think that conclusion, based on a sentence of a freewheeling, unrehearsed conversation, is unfair to Buttigieg.
You can listen for yourself. The relevant passage begins at 5.24.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
still_one
(92,409 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
femmedem
(8,207 posts)Thanks. You and I have both been here a long time, and I know your intent wasn't to misrepresent anything.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
still_one
(92,409 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Renew Deal
(81,873 posts)And thought the Clinton campaign was short on message.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
still_one
(92,409 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Renew Deal
(81,873 posts)So who is propagating misinformation?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
still_one
(92,409 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Stellar
(5,644 posts)It doesn't matter to me if he's gay or straight, Black or White...what can a candidate do to help hard working Americans that were not born with a silver spoon in his mouth?
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Lefta Dissenter
(6,622 posts)More links to stories and video!
Thanks to the Pete-enthusiasts and others for providing great links!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
still_one
(92,409 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
nycbos
(6,038 posts)He has room to grow
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
AlexSFCA
(6,139 posts)I think hell continue to rise in the polls. He is in to to win it.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
berksdem
(595 posts)but Pete is truly a rising star and right at the top of my list. Intelligent, charismatic and intelligent... No doubt he is a fast riser!!!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
California_Republic
(1,826 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
elleng
(131,128 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided