Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

crazytown

(7,277 posts)
Mon Jan 6, 2020, 08:47 AM Jan 2020

Only _____ can beat trump

False. As a matter of strict logic, trump can beat himself.

There are black swan events on the horizon. The crash of the sugar hit economy, whatever is going to happen with Iran, and who knows what else in MF45's toxic world. It would be foolhardy to rely on them, and worse to wish for their birth, but the zeitgeist of 2008 is all around us. Democrats are united in their hatred of the tyranny that is upon us and determined to put it to the electoral sword.

In 2007 I wrote posted a satirical OP, titled something like this: 'No candidate can win the election' - with two word judgments on the contenders. I remember these two HRC: negatives, baggage; Obama: black, green.

To my surprise, DU'ers took it seriously, and agreed with little dissent. When supporting a candidate brings the faults of the others into focus, and it can be like that. As things turned out, our angst and fury were spits of rain as the Great Recession was forming off the coast.

Polls suggest there is a hardcore 45% who, as this time, want MF45 out, no matter what. The GOP fear and smear campaign may soften those numbers, but there is undoubtedly a solid foundation on which to build the blowout necessary to turn the page.

IMO we do not have the luxury of pessimism, however attractive it may be, about any of our candidates chances of winning the GE. Who will win the decisive victory and has the best chance of getting critical Democratic legislation through Congress is the name of the game. Failure is not an option. It's first down, then game on. Hut-hut. My 2c.

This is the time
Because there is no time

Lou Reed.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
3 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Only _____ can beat trump (Original Post) crazytown Jan 2020 OP
I don't believe only one candidate can beat Trump; I DO believe at least one candidate will lose... brooklynite Jan 2020 #1
"As a matter of strict logic, trump can beat himself. " TwilightZone Jan 2020 #2
i agree w you. mopinko Jan 2020 #3
 

brooklynite

(94,601 posts)
1. I don't believe only one candidate can beat Trump; I DO believe at least one candidate will lose...
Mon Jan 6, 2020, 09:04 AM
Jan 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

TwilightZone

(25,471 posts)
2. "As a matter of strict logic, trump can beat himself. "
Mon Jan 6, 2020, 11:21 AM
Jan 2020

No, as a matter of strict logic, someone still has to beat him. He's the incumbent.

Denying his appeal and possibility of reelection is a losing proposition. His support is roughly the same as it was when he was elected, and a common mistake we often make is assuming that approval and disapproval are directly related to who'll vote for him. Plenty of people disapproved of him in 2016 and voted for him anyway. There's little reason to believe that will change this cycle.

"Polls suggest there is a hardcore 45% who, as this time, want MF45 out, no matter what."

Which, of course, isn't enough. It's also nothing new. The vast, vast majority of people made up their minds about Trump years ago. Actual results indicate that a very similar percentage didn't want him to be president in the first place. Since the numbers haven't changed much, if at all, the most important factor, as it usually is, will be turnout.

There's nothing inherently wrong with pessimism about our candidates' relative chances at winning the GE. As you noted, we *must* win, so the ability of a candidate to do so is a factor. There's more to it than that, of course. We need someone who can not only win the presidency, but can contribute to gains in down-ticket, state, and local races, which means turnout again. Keeping the House and winning the Senate are also vitally important where the agenda of any candidate is concerned.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

mopinko

(70,132 posts)
3. i agree w you.
Mon Jan 6, 2020, 11:39 AM
Jan 2020

he will either melt down completely, and his crimes will finally be out there for all but the most blind to see, or we are fucked as a country.
i have great faith in his ability to fuck up everything he touches.
i'm not holding my breath, but at some point the wall has to crumble.
maybe it is a pile of rubble in the history books, looked back on as when the country well and truly went bad. but i dont think cheato or the thug party can withstand the sunshine of a campaign.

yeah, you have to put someone decent out there, but i recall many a flimsy one term congressman who went up against an unbeatable foe. many got turned out 2 years later, but they were breathing, and pointing fingers, and they won where the party thought they couldnt, because it was time for someone to fall.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»Democratic Primaries»Only _____ can beat trump