Democratic Primaries

George II

(67,782 posts) Sun Jan 26, 2020, 03:56 PM Jan 2020

Bernie Sanders said country needed more jails and 'tougher' penalties

Full Headline: Bernie Sanders said country needed more jails and 'tougher' penalties in certain cases in 1994 remarks backing crime bill

By Em Steck and Andrew Kaczynski, CNN
Updated 11:31 AM ET, Sun January 26, 2020

(CNN)Bernie Sanders said in 1994 that he agreed the country needed "some more jails" and that it must be "tougher in certain instances" on crime.

The then-congressman from Vermont made the comments during a news conference in which he explained his support for the now-controversial 1994 crime bill. His remarks, video of which was obtained by CNN's KFile from CCTV-Center for Media & Democracy, a Vermont public access station, sheds light on Sanders' support of the now more controversial elements of the bill, and his reservations about other aspects.

"On the other hand, do I think we need some more jails? Yup. Do I think we have to get tougher in certain instances? Yes, I do," Sanders said. "So what you have is a balance here. You have more money going to law enforcement, more money going into jails. You have, on the other hand, significant sums of money going into prevention, beginning to allow us to deal with violence against women, child abuse and other very serious problems," Sanders said.

"This legislation is not perfect. Let's be clear about it," he added. "But at a time when the citizens of this country are crying out for the government to begin addressing the crisis of crime, there is no question in my mind that this bill, in a dozen different ways, is a major step forward in controlling and preventing crime. It is a bill that should be supported."

"Number one, simply and straightforwardly, we need more cops on the beat," Sanders said, adding that the bill would provide Vermont $43 million to hire new police officers. "The state of Vermont needs more police officers. We need more community policing. We need more police protection in our most rural areas, and this legislation will play a significant role in allowing that to happen."

"Number two, equally importantly," Sanders said. "While this legislation is very strong on increasing police protection -- on stiffening penalties against criminals so that violent offenders remain behind bars where they should be -- it also provides a significant sum of money to prevent crime."

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

47 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Bernie Sanders said country needed more jails and 'tougher' penalties (Original Post) George II Jan 2020 OP

Sounds like a very early endorsement for Joe. RandySF Jan 2020 #1

Again attacking Bernie for having the exact same position as Biden 25 years ago???? DanTex Jan 2020 #2

I believe... pfeiffer Jan 2020 #5

The point is it's not attacking Sanders for having the same position, it's the fact that now.... George II Jan 2020 #6

So this is "whataboutism"? Huh. OK, I get it. DanTex Jan 2020 #18

Not "whataboutism", more like "sameaboutism". Remember, we're talking about a single bill.... George II Jan 2020 #24

All I see here is Bernie getting bashed for it. And everyone is all excited about it, too. DanTex Jan 2020 #26

+1000 UniteFightBack Jan 2020 #22

The reverse would seem to be true. TwilightZone Jan 2020 #7

Well I agree there too. Attacking for the same stance makes no sense. In either direction. DanTex Jan 2020 #8

Turner, Gray, and Sirota have been doing it for at least a week, no one from Biden's campaign has... George II Jan 2020 #25

NO, dantex.. you have it Wrong.. It's Showing the Cha Jan 2020 #13

Umm, right now, you and the Biden people are attacking Bernie for it. DanTex Jan 2020 #14

No, dantex.. you're Wrong.. this is about Hypocrisy. Cha Jan 2020 #17

Actually, it really seems like whataboutism. Don't you think? DanTex Jan 2020 #19

No Thekaspervote Jan 2020 #20

of course you would say that.. Wrong Again. Cha Jan 2020 #23

Actually you're mistaken Cha Jan 2020 #45

Shine the Light! Get it out there..VIRAL IT.. it's on the "INTERNET"! Cha Jan 2020 #3

It's not the vote. It's the rank hypocrisy. SaschaHM Jan 2020 #4

Sounds like he agreed with Biden on a couple of things. nt Autumn Jan 2020 #9

ICYMI: This is to point out the hypocritical attacks on Biden... NurseJackie Jan 2020 #11

I was told yesterday by a very good Biden supporter that when it comes to pointing there are fingers Autumn Jan 2020 #12

That's it? Seriously? NurseJackie Jan 2020 #28

There's a lot of "I am rubber, you are glue..." going around too, the pukes are good at that . Autumn Jan 2020 #31

Isn't this just "whataboutism"? DanTex Jan 2020 #16

Nope. It's pointing out hypocrisy. NurseJackie Jan 2020 #27

But when I point out hypocrisy, everyone says it's "whataboutism". DanTex Jan 2020 #30

Yes. You're smart. Figure it out yourself. NurseJackie Jan 2020 #40

Whatabouism has to do with bringing up an unrelated issue to excuse certain behavior dansolo Jan 2020 #44

Kinda weird. Like, on Bernie's worst day, he's the same as Biden. And then on the other days, DanTex Jan 2020 #15

No. It's an argument against Bernie. Autumn Jan 2020 #21

It's an "argument" (not really) on the hypocrisy of one candidate condemning another.... George II Jan 2020 #34

Biden GOOD .. BS BAD.. fixed it. Cha Jan 2020 #46

Actually not, he disagrees on the impact of the two votes which were identical: George II Jan 2020 #33

Bernie didn't write the bill and to be clear he supported the Violence Against Women Act Autumn Jan 2020 #35

He voted for it. Period. And in 1995 he tried to get Democrats to increase the penalties in the bill George II Jan 2020 #36

Yes he voted for it, he supported the VAW act that was inserted into it. He was not happy he did. Autumn Jan 2020 #38

It's the same old, same old. A bad bill "I voted for it because it had something good", and then... George II Jan 2020 #39

BS voted for the 1994 CRIME Bill BAD!!!!! Cha Jan 2020 #43

Yeah we do need much tougher penalities 47of74 Jan 2020 #10

Did he lie when he said he just voted for it for VAWA? mcar Jan 2020 #29

I am so glad that there is an internet Gothmog Jan 2020 #32

K&R betsuni Jan 2020 #37

And he had the audacity to blame Biden for it NCProgressive Jan 2020 #41

Yeah.. it's called "hypocrisy".. Cha Jan 2020 #47

K&R nt NYMinute Jan 2020 #42

RandySF

(58,928 posts)

1. Sounds like a very early endorsement for Joe.

Reply to George II (Original post)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 03:58 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

2. Again attacking Bernie for having the exact same position as Biden 25 years ago????

Reply to George II (Original post)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 03:59 PM

Jan 2020

Seriously, it's come to this? Like you can't find something to attack Bernie on that Biden didn't vote the exact same way on?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

pfeiffer

(280 posts)

5. I believe...

Reply to DanTex (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:04 PM

Jan 2020

the point of this post is to remind Bernie supporters that Bernie's record back in the 90's is just as relevant as his supporters think Joe's is.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

George II

(67,782 posts)

6. The point is it's not attacking Sanders for having the same position, it's the fact that now....

Reply to DanTex (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:05 PM

Jan 2020

....Sanders and his surrogates are attacking BIDEN for having the same position.

Seriously, THAT is what it's come to.

As the saying goes (at least for most candidates), "you can't have it both ways!"

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

18. So this is "whataboutism"? Huh. OK, I get it.

Reply to George II (Reply #6)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:24 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

George II

(67,782 posts)

24. Not "whataboutism", more like "sameaboutism". Remember, we're talking about a single bill....

Reply to DanTex (Reply #18)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:31 PM

Jan 2020

....for which two candidates BOTH voted. One candidate's campaign is bashing the other candidate for voting for the bill. The other candidate's campaign isn't doing such. Ok?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

26. All I see here is Bernie getting bashed for it. And everyone is all excited about it, too.

Reply to George II (Reply #24)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:53 PM

Jan 2020

I agree, bashing someone for the same bill as the other person voted for is counterproductive.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)

22. +1000

Reply to George II (Reply #6)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:29 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

TwilightZone

(25,472 posts)

7. The reverse would seem to be true.

Reply to DanTex (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:06 PM

Jan 2020

It's the hypocrisy of Sanders attacking others -- pretty vehemently, I might add -- for stances that he also held.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

8. Well I agree there too. Attacking for the same stance makes no sense. In either direction.

Reply to TwilightZone (Reply #7)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:07 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

George II

(67,782 posts)

25. Turner, Gray, and Sirota have been doing it for at least a week, no one from Biden's campaign has...

Reply to DanTex (Reply #8)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:49 PM

Jan 2020

And they've been doing it on Social Security, too - totally misrepresenting Biden's position, which doesn't differ from Sanders' position.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Cha

(297,323 posts)

13. NO, dantex.. you have it Wrong.. It's Showing the

Reply to DanTex (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:20 PM

Jan 2020

Hypocrisy of the BS campaign Attacking Joe Biden on this issue.

Link to tweet

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

14. Umm, right now, you and the Biden people are attacking Bernie for it.

Reply to Cha (Reply #13)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:21 PM

Jan 2020

With some serious passion, I might add. Kind of weird, since it's the same vote for both.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

Cha

(297,323 posts)

17. No, dantex.. you're Wrong.. this is about Hypocrisy.

Reply to DanTex (Reply #14)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:24 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

19. Actually, it really seems like whataboutism. Don't you think?

Reply to Cha (Reply #17)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:24 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

Thekaspervote

(32,778 posts)

20. No

Reply to DanTex (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:28 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Cha

(297,323 posts)

23. of course you would say that.. Wrong Again.

Reply to DanTex (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:31 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Cha

(297,323 posts)

45. Actually you're mistaken

Reply to DanTex (Reply #19)

Mon Jan 27, 2020, 10:14 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Cha

(297,323 posts)

3. Shine the Light! Get it out there..VIRAL IT.. it's on the "INTERNET"!

Reply to George II (Original post)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:00 PM

Jan 2020

Link to tweet

I borrowed this from Otto's OP..

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=447697

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

SaschaHM

(2,897 posts)

4. It's not the vote. It's the rank hypocrisy.

Reply to George II (Original post)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:02 PM

Jan 2020

This is far from the explanation that he gave in 2016 while attacking Hillary Clinton for a bill that her husband signed. If Bernie didn't try to use the Crime Bill as a wedge issue to hurt Clinton w/ AA voters, this video would be meaningless.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Autumn

(45,109 posts)

9. Sounds like he agreed with Biden on a couple of things. nt

Reply to George II (Original post)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:08 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)

11. ICYMI: This is to point out the hypocritical attacks on Biden...

Reply to Autumn (Reply #9)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:13 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Autumn

(45,109 posts)

12. I was told yesterday by a very good Biden supporter that when it comes to pointing there are fingers

Reply to NurseJackie (Reply #11)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:16 PM

Jan 2020

pointing back at you. It makes sense

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)

28. That's it? Seriously?

Reply to Autumn (Reply #12)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:58 PM

Jan 2020

The last person who said that to me also liked the phrase "I am rubber, you are glue..."

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Autumn

(45,109 posts)

31. There's a lot of "I am rubber, you are glue..." going around too, the pukes are good at that .

Reply to NurseJackie (Reply #28)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 05:08 PM

Jan 2020

Very middles schoolish. But whatever... I'm done for today. Have a good one.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

16. Isn't this just "whataboutism"?

Reply to NurseJackie (Reply #11)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:23 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)

27. Nope. It's pointing out hypocrisy.

Reply to DanTex (Reply #16)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:57 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

30. But when I point out hypocrisy, everyone says it's "whataboutism".

Reply to NurseJackie (Reply #27)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 05:01 PM

Jan 2020

Is there anyway to tell the difference?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)

40. Yes. You're smart. Figure it out yourself.

Reply to DanTex (Reply #30)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 06:49 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

dansolo

(5,376 posts)

44. Whatabouism has to do with bringing up an unrelated issue to excuse certain behavior

Reply to DanTex (Reply #30)

Mon Jan 27, 2020, 07:57 AM

Jan 2020

Pointing out hypocrisy occurs when a person's own position contradict what they are claiming. Sanders will attack another candidate for holding a certain position, implying that his own positions were different at the time.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

DanTex

(20,709 posts)

15. Kinda weird. Like, on Bernie's worst day, he's the same as Biden. And then on the other days,

Reply to Autumn (Reply #9)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:22 PM

Jan 2020

like the Iraq War day, he's better. This is supposed to be an argument for Biden?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

Autumn

(45,109 posts)

21. No. It's an argument against Bernie.

Reply to DanTex (Reply #15)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:29 PM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

George II

(67,782 posts)

34. It's an "argument" (not really) on the hypocrisy of one candidate condemning another....

Reply to Autumn (Reply #21)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 05:35 PM

Jan 2020

...for doing exactly the same thing.

They both voted for the bill, but Biden BAD and Sanders GOOD.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Cha

(297,323 posts)

46. Biden GOOD .. BS BAD.. fixed it.

Reply to George II (Reply #34)

Tue Jan 28, 2020, 03:04 AM

Jan 2020

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

George II

(67,782 posts)

33. Actually not, he disagrees on the impact of the two votes which were identical:

Reply to Autumn (Reply #9)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 05:33 PM

Jan 2020

Biden voted for the 1994 crime bill - BAD!
Sanders voted for the 1994 crime bill - GOOD!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Autumn

(45,109 posts)

35. Bernie didn't write the bill and to be clear he supported the Violence Against Women Act

Reply to George II (Reply #33)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 05:41 PM

Jan 2020

that was included in it. Things like that are often added to unpopular bills to get votes, as you well know George.

At the same time, the law included several measures that would be far less controversial among Democrats today. The Violence Against Women Act provided more resources to crack down on domestic violence and rape. A provision helped fund background checks for guns. The law encouraged states to back drug courts, which attempt to divert drug offenders from prison into treatment, and also helped fund some addiction treatment.

All of this was an old-school attempt to attract votes from lawmakers who otherwise might be skeptical — and it succeeded at winning over some Democrats. Bernie Sanders, for one, criticized an earlier version of the bill, written in 1991 but never passed, for supporting mass incarceration, quipping, “What do we have to do, put half the country behind bars?” But he voted for the 1994 law, explaining at the time, “I have a number of serious problems with the crime bill, but one part of it that I vigorously support is the Violence Against Women Act.”

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/6/20/18677998/joe-biden-1994-crime-bill-law-mass-incarceration

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

George II

(67,782 posts)

36. He voted for it. Period. And in 1995 he tried to get Democrats to increase the penalties in the bill

Reply to Autumn (Reply #35)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 05:44 PM

Jan 2020

Did you see this?

Link to tweet

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Autumn

(45,109 posts)

38. Yes he voted for it, he supported the VAW act that was inserted into it. He was not happy he did.

Reply to George II (Reply #36)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 05:52 PM

Jan 2020

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/6/20/18677998/joe-biden-1994-crime-bill-law-mass-incarceration

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided

George II

(67,782 posts)

39. It's the same old, same old. A bad bill "I voted for it because it had something good", and then...

Reply to Autumn (Reply #38)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 05:56 PM

Jan 2020

....A good bill "I voted against it because it had something bad in it."

At long last that story isn't working anymore. Either you vote FOR it as it is, or you vote AGAINST it as it is.

It's "AYE" or "NAY", not "AYE but" or "NAY but".

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

Cha

(297,323 posts)

43. BS voted for the 1994 CRIME Bill BAD!!!!!

Reply to George II (Reply #33)

Mon Jan 27, 2020, 05:30 AM

Jan 2020

Biden voted for the 1994 Crime Bill-Good!

Link to tweet

Fixed it.

Karma!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden

47of74

(18,470 posts)

10. Yeah we do need much tougher penalities

Reply to George II (Original post)

Sun Jan 26, 2020, 04:12 PM

Jan 2020

For things like voter suppression, electoral fraud, and vote tampering. Those should be punishable by public execution. We have to show the world we are not fucking around when it comes to the integrity of elections.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden