then we get a progressive. A lot of people vote for centrists because of perceived electability, not because they support centrist policies. A small chunk of those coming around is all it takes.

might want to read up on McGovern...horrible loss...lost 49 of 50 states...

"All the while, the Democratic Party became increasingly comfortable embracing hard-left positions—pushed, in large part, by the same forces demanding a change to the nomination process. By the time of the 1972 Democratic National Convention, the party’s platform was perhaps further left than it had ever been, calling for, among other planks, “a decent job for every American” and income supports for those out of work, as well as a universal single-payer health care system.

The party’s presidential nominee would be the same man who’d been tapped to overhaul the nominating process: George McGovern—whose candidacy was “a backlash against 1968 and the old Democratic machine politics,” says University of Minnesota political scientist Lawrence Jacobs."

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/10/09/democrats-mcgovern-1972-trump-nixon-2020-215687

The same kind of highly qualified centrist, firmly "establishment," part of the Obama administration, with a lot of the same positions in the past including on IWR and NAFTA. Against the same guy we have to beat this time around.

And all the Washington Post people crying "McGovern!" were sure she was going to win.

There's another electability argument that centers around bringing out the base and new voters with bold progressive policies that excite people.

We run left we lose...those of you who think Trump will be easy to knock off are wrong.

Allegations and bumper stickers ain't gonna get the votes.

The US is still by far a center to center left country, whereas your man BS is a far left socialist who is using the Democratic Party to further his ambitions.

If, and I truly think it's a reach, he becomes our candidate, then prepare yourself for another 4 years of the Mango Menace and the possible loss of the House and the retention of the Senate by the repigs.

not only would he be annihilated in the GE, but he could also lose the House to the repigs.

The Left thinks everyone hates Trump as much as they do... but he has higher poll numbers than Obama did in 12. He is likely to win...and if we run left, we lose 35 states, the house and any chance at the Senate.

But I Beeeeliiiieeeeveee I will see the one Sanders rides to work every day. The one that poops billion$ to pay for all the free stuff he's promising.

smear of being called "centrists." More "plausibly deniable" that calling them neoliberals or corporatists, I suppose.

Nearly all the liberals you insult in this fashion have much more impressive records of progressive accomplishments than the junior Senator (I) from Vermont.

And they have much more in common with FDR and the liberal traditions of our party than he does as well.

FDR was not affiliated with the Socialist Workers Party, just for your information.

FDR was proud to be a liberal Democrat. Same here.

don't seem to have Warren on Team Red (Socialist) but on Team Blue (Liberals).

Team Red only got about 26% of the vote. Team Blue 74%.

Looks like someone's going to bed hungry tonight.

Go liberals!!!

of the word progressive. I think most of our Dems are progressive and do not think just the far left owns the word.

But, I do not think little p progressive is all Warrens base. I think Warren has a lot of the Clinton support that are not backing Biden at this point. I think it is wrong to combine the numbers of Warren and Sanders and assume they are the same voter.

surely happen.

“If 50 million people say a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing.”

― Anatole France

At least they are unless your definition of that word is so narrow that only one person fits it.

So there's that.

Bernie seems to do better when the actual votes aren't counted, but a limited number of people make the decision for everyone in the state, and a small group of hyper-enthusiastic and overbearing people can wear down others.

Frankly, caucuses are the least democratic of systems for a primary.

Thanks for the thread DanTex.

I'd love single payer. It's not happening. Voters don't like it, and Congress won't pass it.

I don't like the FJG. It's going to be hugely expensive and I don't see how it's even workable.

I don't like the wealth tax. It's expensive, hard to implement, and easy to dodge.

I don't like blanket forgiveness for college debt.

I don't like free 4-year college for all.

I'm far left but these two just don't seem grounded in reality. I don't think they can beat Trump, either.