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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

RandySF

(58,856 posts)
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:40 PM Feb 2020

Juan Williams: Don't count Biden out

Conventional political wisdom is often wrong.

But in all my years on the presidential campaign trail, I can’t recall a time when the accepted wisdom of the moment is so wrongheaded and damaging to one candidate.

To play on a line from Mark Twain, reports of Joe Biden’s political demise have been greatly exaggerated.

Yes, the former vice president had a disappointing showing in the first two Democratic presidential contests — placing fourth in the Iowa caucuses and fifth in the New Hampshire primary.

But keep in mind Iowa and New Hampshire awarded less than two percent of the available delegates.

The consensus that Biden’s 2020 hopes are doomed is also being fueled by the barrage coming from the man who fears his candidacy the most — President Trump.

Trump is so scared of facing Biden in a general election that the president got himself impeached for trying to get a foreign leader to damage Biden’s campaign.




https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/483266-juan-williams-dont-count-biden-out

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
27 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Juan Williams: Don't count Biden out (Original Post) RandySF Feb 2020 OP
My question for Biden people: BusyBeingBest Feb 2020 #1
I guess I don't have that perception JustAnotherGen Feb 2020 #2
I don't give much weight to those states either, but looking at those regions BusyBeingBest Feb 2020 #5
I think he can grab 'em JustAnotherGen Feb 2020 #22
His and his family names smeared has not helped...then Bernie staffers saying he is corrupt was UniteFightBack Feb 2020 #3
I do think people are leery of backing him in case something damning comes out BusyBeingBest Feb 2020 #7
I expect pukes to fall for the lies...not Democrats. Impeachment was worth it for him as it UniteFightBack Feb 2020 #10
Because his core constituency is people of color CalFione Feb 2020 #4
When did that become his core constituency? I had always thought he BusyBeingBest Feb 2020 #6
Beats me. It is the Biden campaign that decided that POC would be their primary focus. CalFione Feb 2020 #8
The thing is that Biden is polling quite poorly with POC except for black voters. Ace Rothstein Feb 2020 #11
Black voters are a HUGE percentage of Democratic primary voters in SC CalFione Feb 2020 #12
Right but that's only going to help him in what, 20% of states? Ace Rothstein Feb 2020 #13
Momentum breeds momentum CalFione Feb 2020 #17
So white people don't like him now? cwydro Feb 2020 #15
He's not #1 among white Democrats at the moment CalFione Feb 2020 #16
Iowa is weird and always likes the shiny new thing... W_HAMILTON Feb 2020 #25
Who is counting Biden out? Talking heads? there are many miles to go in this election. nt yaesu Feb 2020 #9
The news stories that correctly point out he leads in SC and is within striking distance of Bernie emmaverybo Feb 2020 #14
I'm not. Two lily-white states are a tiny fraction of US voters. n/t CousinIT Feb 2020 #18
I really like Joe-- such a big heart andym Feb 2020 #19
Trump got fidgety Zeus69 Feb 2020 #20
Totally agree. There is ALOT of race left and Biden has the AA vote coming up. Vivienne235729 Feb 2020 #21
Don't bet against Joe Biden just yet. He has an ace up his sleeve Gothmog Feb 2020 #23
Biden needs a good performance tomorrow night. squirecam Feb 2020 #26
Shades of Paul Tsongas Jersey Devil Feb 2020 #24
Biden pretty much planned not to do well in Iowa or NH, so he wasn't surprised by his showing. tblue37 Feb 2020 #27
 

BusyBeingBest

(8,054 posts)
1. My question for Biden people:
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:44 PM
Feb 2020

Why was Biden not even the third or fourth choice of the first two states? Do you think it's because Trump's Hunter attacks worked, or is it because of his often unsteady performance on the trail? Old and tired looking? Because lord knows it's not lack of familiarity or resume.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

JustAnotherGen

(31,828 posts)
2. I guess I don't have that perception
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:48 PM
Feb 2020

Of any of our older (Boomer/Silent) candidates. IE Unsteady.

I do think Iowa and NH are less of a litmus test. They don't represent the massive shift in population we are undergoing. Where the 'new Dominant Culture' is rising - is where candidates such as Biden, Steyer, Bloomberg and yes - even Klobuchar will shine.

We aren't monoliths - but I do think we are pragmatic and know nothing is going to happen with the snap of the fingers. So - practical and pragmatic candidates *I think - just my opinion* might do better outside of the narrow population states.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BusyBeingBest

(8,054 posts)
5. I don't give much weight to those states either, but looking at those regions
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:55 PM
Feb 2020

and their (mostly white folk) voting, I'm trying to pin down what it was that made him collapse like that, and what he can do to correct it besides simply relying more on African Americans and Hispanics. His appeal is pragmatic and practical, I agree--he's a known quantity and that is comforting and maybe he'll do better elsewhere, but we definitely need some White Dude Lunchbox votes, and I thought that would have appeared for him at least somewhat.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

JustAnotherGen

(31,828 posts)
22. I think he can grab 'em
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 04:28 PM
Feb 2020

by their beards in Ohio, PA, MI and WI - maybe even in Florida. But - I've completely written off Texas and Florida for Electoral College votes. It's not the voters - it's the Governors in those states.

There's no way that little asshole in Florida isn't going to engage in shenanigans to keep black and brown votes from being counted.
Ditto the big asshole in Texas.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)
3. His and his family names smeared has not helped...then Bernie staffers saying he is corrupt was
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:48 PM
Feb 2020

just disgusting.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BusyBeingBest

(8,054 posts)
7. I do think people are leery of backing him in case something damning comes out
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:58 PM
Feb 2020

of the Ukraine stuff, unfair and unlikely as that is.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)
10. I expect pukes to fall for the lies...not Democrats. Impeachment was worth it for him as it
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:11 PM
Feb 2020

damaged our best candidate to win the general....I didn't think it would, I stupidly thought that Dems would rally around him and NOT let that happen.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

CalFione

(571 posts)
4. Because his core constituency is people of color
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:51 PM
Feb 2020

.. and neither of those states have many people of color.

Simple as that.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BusyBeingBest

(8,054 posts)
6. When did that become his core constituency? I had always thought he
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:57 PM
Feb 2020

wanted the Scranton-boy working class Joe white guy image, because that's who the Dems have been losing. On edit--that's why Obama picked him, in large part. His strength with working class whites.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

CalFione

(571 posts)
8. Beats me. It is the Biden campaign that decided that POC would be their primary focus.
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 01:59 PM
Feb 2020

It's not a bad plan, considering POC make up 40% of the Democratic electorate.

We'll see if it pays off in SC.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Ace Rothstein

(3,163 posts)
11. The thing is that Biden is polling quite poorly with POC except for black voters.
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:16 PM
Feb 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

CalFione

(571 posts)
12. Black voters are a HUGE percentage of Democratic primary voters in SC
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:19 PM
Feb 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Ace Rothstein

(3,163 posts)
13. Right but that's only going to help him in what, 20% of states?
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:22 PM
Feb 2020

He needs to pick it up with pretty much every other demo in order to win.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

CalFione

(571 posts)
17. Momentum breeds momentum
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:40 PM
Feb 2020

If he wins SC, then he has the air of "comeback kid" going into the Super Tuesday states. That perhaps brings his numbers back up with white voters too, if they perceive he has a chance to win.


Winning breeds winning.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

cwydro

(51,308 posts)
15. So white people don't like him now?
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:35 PM
Feb 2020

He’s gonna need white folks too.

Without a doubt.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

CalFione

(571 posts)
16. He's not #1 among white Democrats at the moment
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:37 PM
Feb 2020

He's not even #2 or #3.


But he is #1 among black Democrats at the moment.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

W_HAMILTON

(7,867 posts)
25. Iowa is weird and always likes the shiny new thing...
Tue Feb 18, 2020, 06:38 PM
Feb 2020

...and then Biden's relative poor showing there and all the subsequent bad news about it impacted his performance in New Hampshire.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

yaesu

(8,020 posts)
9. Who is counting Biden out? Talking heads? there are many miles to go in this election. nt
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:05 PM
Feb 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
14. The news stories that correctly point out he leads in SC and is within striking distance of Bernie
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:23 PM
Feb 2020

in Nevada phrase these facts as “SC is do or die and his AA support is eroding;” “he trails Bernie in
Nevada.” Two local online announcements of a BFD, Lt. Gov. Marshall’s endorsement, affixed photos of two other candidates to their stories, and in one case, also a story, about Amy, not Joe.

Definitely, a funereal tone pervades any news that, were it about any other candidate would be framed as their being highly competitive, on the verge of overtaking etc.

The language of decline and past failure (two tiny states) for one and success or surge for the rest.

Except for Warren whom MSM elevated for a time in the sun and then precipitously dropped like a hot potato, her name now alongside Biden’s in the kiss of death, do or die column.

What Williams points out that is crucial to anyone’s premature inaugural ball is that Trump has taken on no other candidate and no other held the lead for almost a year nationally and state by state and in toe to toe’s and was so miserably bashed and dismissed for doing so. God hated a winner then.

I think Joe will prove strong in Nevada and still, despite moneybags coming to town, prevail.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

CousinIT

(9,245 posts)
18. I'm not. Two lily-white states are a tiny fraction of US voters. n/t
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:41 PM
Feb 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

andym

(5,443 posts)
19. I really like Joe-- such a big heart
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:46 PM
Feb 2020

I hope he does better going forward.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Zeus69

(391 posts)
20. Trump got fidgety
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 02:54 PM
Feb 2020

When national polls showed Biden to be his clearest threat on the path to reelection. It was soon after that when Burisma reared its head.

The only other candidate I feel Trump and Republicans are worried about is Bloomberg.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Vivienne235729

(3,384 posts)
21. Totally agree. There is ALOT of race left and Biden has the AA vote coming up.
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 03:34 PM
Feb 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(145,279 posts)
23. Don't bet against Joe Biden just yet. He has an ace up his sleeve
Tue Feb 18, 2020, 06:34 PM
Feb 2020



The polls, however, show the pundits are wrong. Biden has always been strongest among black voters, in part because he was vice president to Barack Obama, the nation’s first black president. Contrary to predictions, blacks have not abandoned Biden’s allegedly sinking ship. Instead, polls taken since New Hampshire in five different states by five different pollsters show Biden receiving between 36 percent and 41.5 percent of the black vote. That’s an amazingly consistent result and unlikely to be a coincidence.

These findings show how Biden can get back into the top tier of candidates. Black voters were 13 percent of Nevada’s Democratic electorate in 2016, likely large enough to let Biden break the 15 percent threshold there that qualifies him to get delegates with minimal support from other voters. The Democratic primary electorate in South Carolina, the final state to vote before Super Tuesday on March 3, was 61 percent black in 2016. That’s large enough to let Biden win if he gets 40 percent or so of the black vote, even if he gets a paltry 10 percent or so among whites. He will then go into the 14 states voting on Super Tuesday with momentum fueled by black voters.

Biden’s bet on black voters should then pay off big. In 2016, black voters comprised at least 19 percent of the Democratic vote in six Super Tuesday states and were about a third to half of the vote in three of them. Biden should finish in the top three in all of those and could even win some depending on how well he does among whites. That gives him media buzz and delegates.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

squirecam

(2,706 posts)
26. Biden needs a good performance tomorrow night.
Tue Feb 18, 2020, 06:44 PM
Feb 2020

If does poorly, NV voters could abandon him.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Jersey Devil

(9,874 posts)
24. Shades of Paul Tsongas
Tue Feb 18, 2020, 06:37 PM
Feb 2020

I am not counting anyone out at this point. I remember 1992 voting in the NJ primary sometime in June for Paul Tsongas who was the front runner at the time. I don't think Clinton had even won one primary at that point.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

tblue37

(65,377 posts)
27. Biden pretty much planned not to do well in Iowa or NH, so he wasn't surprised by his showing.
Tue Feb 18, 2020, 06:59 PM
Feb 2020

But because the media jumped on it to declare his campaign dead in the water, it's in danger of becoming an unfair self-fulfilling prophecy.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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