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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:47 PM Mar 2020

I too was a willing part of "the establishment".

No, I have never held political office outside of my union, but inside my union, I was an officer on my local Board, and I was a union representative for over 30 years.

And as an officer, as part of the establishment, I helped craft local policy for the union.

And as a convention delegate, as part of the establishment, I help craft policy for the national union.

And as a union representative, an elected member of the establishment, I helped craft our local office agreement, which dealt with many facets of my home office.

How did I become a part of the establishment? I was elected after becoming active in the local union, and by helping the current establishment as they worked for the union.

It is vital to remember that the establishment is a necessary part of any organization, because outside of a very small family unit. we need an establishment, however we term it, to coordinate the necessary activities of the organization. Nothing accomplishes itself.

At times, I would hear local complaints about how the union, or the establishment, if you prefer, was making decisions that a local member or members did not like.

My response was quite simple. I asked the member what they did to participate in the decision making process. Almost every time, the member would admit that he/she/they never attended local or general meetings, and never communicated with the local officers.

And after he/she/they admitted that, I would respond that their own inaction indicated to me that they agreed by default with the union position.

So please, all who speak of the establishment, tell me what organization does not have an establishment.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
10 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I too was a willing part of "the establishment". (Original Post) guillaumeb Mar 2020 OP
An excellent post my madaboutharry inspired this allied post. guillaumeb Mar 2020 #1
Every clique is an establishment. marble falls Mar 2020 #2
And it is unavoidable. guillaumeb Mar 2020 #3
Its helpful to both parties: they know who they are and we know who they are. marble falls Mar 2020 #4
Bernie calls it establishment, showblue22 Mar 2020 #5
A good observation. guillaumeb Mar 2020 #7
Did any of your fellow members denigrate you for being part of those establishments? TwilightZone Mar 2020 #6
Yes, there were complaints. guillaumeb Mar 2020 #8
I ONLY criticize the use of "establishment" as stigma.It's not to be used that way by Democrats, imo ancianita Mar 2020 #9
I agree with your excellent analysis. guillaumeb Mar 2020 #10
 

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
1. An excellent post my madaboutharry inspired this allied post.
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:48 PM
Mar 2020

If you have not seen it, I highly recommend it.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287616538

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

marble falls

(57,172 posts)
2. Every clique is an establishment.
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:49 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
3. And it is unavoidable.
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:51 PM
Mar 2020

We all have voice, and a vote. Yes, some voices are louder, some more listened to, but that is often because the member ship gives those voices greater weight.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

marble falls

(57,172 posts)
4. Its helpful to both parties: they know who they are and we know who they are.
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:52 PM
Mar 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

showblue22

(1,026 posts)
5. Bernie calls it establishment,
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:53 PM
Mar 2020

Others call it deep state.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
7. A good observation.
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:55 PM
Mar 2020

And in each case, it is intended as a negative. But it implies a separation, a sense that the establishment is oppressing the people.

And of course history is filled with such examples, but sometimes we must admit that what we believe to be the best course of action is not something that a current majority accepts as true.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

TwilightZone

(25,473 posts)
6. Did any of your fellow members denigrate you for being part of those establishments?
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:54 PM
Mar 2020

Therein lies the difference.

This isn't difficult. Denigrating most Democrats for being the "establishment" is silly, regardless of the definition or the source, especially when the critic has been part of the same establishment for decades.

It's also a rather odd strategy since they're the ones who get stuff done and build coalitions.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
8. Yes, there were complaints.
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 04:58 PM
Mar 2020

I was a long time member of a national team that worked in many local offices. During an office visit, in my own large local, I was confronted by a member of the union who asked me if I ever considered that what I was doing in the offices might be stressful for the affected members.

I responded that yes, as a union officer and representative, such considerations were always a concern. The member apologized and admitted to never attending any meetings.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ancianita

(36,132 posts)
9. I ONLY criticize the use of "establishment" as stigma.It's not to be used that way by Democrats, imo
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 05:02 PM
Mar 2020

I've been part of the establishment for my local AFT Local #1. I know the world you work in.

I'm no critic of the establishment, knowing that the working class helped build it.

And I'm to the left of Bernie.

I remain a Democrat who supports the Democratic Party.

If people can't use establishment as anything but stigma or some virtue signalling label, if they have no better language control than what divides, they are the ones I criticize.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

guillaumeb

(42,641 posts)
10. I agree with your excellent analysis.
Tue Mar 3, 2020, 05:34 PM
Mar 2020

As you said, every organization builds its own establishment.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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