yes, policies and voting record are important but they come in to ply only after we can assess who is more likely to beat trump. We only have one goal in this election.

But we should consider that Elizabeth’s pithy attacks on the Bankruptcy Act will be taken up by the Republicans. She won’t tone it down and no one should expect her to.

right candidate for this time in history. I could live with Elizabeth... her deep thinking on issues like bankruptcy is the right way to go.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

but this bandwagon for Biden is really annoying me.

If we elect a steady as she goes, return to normal candidate, we will get creamed in 2022, like we did in 1994 and 2010. People have had it with Reagans normal. I agree with Pete here- defending a system that is failing people waters the garden for another Trump, or worse.

All those years of people watching the heartland rust. It is wrong.

This return to the status quo with Joe is definitely NOT the way to go. Why play it safe with "normalcy" when we should be delivering what The People are clamoring for!! Of course, they'll decide through this primary process... it's called "democracy."


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

Joe is a good guy, and a loyal democrat. But people want change, not a return to normalcy. MF45 stole the election but the support he got was because he promised change (and the racism). Listen to AOC she's super smart and plugged in, she gets it. Free healthcare (no more private insurance), abolish ICE, the Green New Deal. Almost everyone I talk to thinks these are great ideas.

We should be worrying about getting new voters (about half of the country doesn't vote). We don't need MF45s voters. I don't know why our party is so scared of progressive ideas, they're really popular with sane people.

I do qualify my judgments on previous administrations. The defeat in 2010 meant Obama had to shelve his infrastructure plans. The same happened to WJC.

But to avoid those defeats the new Administration has to strike down Reagans economics from the outset, and beak from the past. The next Dem President will have to master Twitter too.

AOC might have some ideas here

I think Sanders will be forced out fairly early in the primary.

May the best candidate win... then, as I always say, vote blue, no matter who!!


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

You're right. Her call out is right. But rightness doesn't usually win across this country.

Her call out demands the kind of memory that makes people feel not up to the task of deciding whether her economics stands can win.

They'll also consider overall governance experience, first. Name recognition domestically. Status internationally.

Just pointing out some mitigating ground to re-examine your support with.

He would have to make the case that you can only declare bankruptcy if you overleveraged your casino and you already used the money you borrowed for vacations and private planes.

bc they excite you. next thing you know lots ppl are excited about your candidate

once he comes out from under Obama's reflected glory?

I see no other candidate except maybe Ryan who can do this. Aso I do not believe any woman can be elected president in 20...too much sexism. I am going for the win. We must get rid of aTrump.

Strong in rust belt states. He’s for nafta, cafta, TPP etc and that doesn’t play well there. Also, he was for the bankruptcy bill, as pointed out. I know he has/tries to have a blue collar persona but his positions on the issues could definitely be used against him.

All they see is the experienced, likeable establishment savior. They don't see how people are unhappy with what the establishment has been doing for the last 25 years and how Trump exploits that without offering real solutions.

all of them.


... we need to make sure ... strategically as a party that we don't come to be viewed as the defenders of a system that is letting people down. And we wouldn't be here if the economic and political system hadn't failed people.

... The system needs to be changed profoundly. I guess that's my point. We can't just nibble around the edges and expect people to be happy with us. Now, I've got a slightly different account than my competitors do about how best to do it, but the fundamental lesson is that our economic and political system has been letting people down I would say for my entire lifetime.

Pete Buttigieg

Trump ran on fixing manufacturing in the rustbelt.i see no other candidate that can. Compete on this issue other than Biden. Sure we vote for whoever em emerges but it won't be enough.

Biden can take those states.

So get over yourself.

But I still don't believe it. Repeating sometjing over and over doesn't make it true.

But that's not a rationale, that's a conclusion. I'm not saying he can't win, I just don't think it is so simple.

reasons.

He stole the election with the help of the Russians. Mantafort gave polling data to the Russians so they would know what votes to change. Everyone hates MF45, in a fair election any of our candidates will win. Let's nominate the most progressive candidate to help the country. The Green New Deal is the most important issue.

There's no way out of that. Warren can go on about the Bankruptcy issue until the cows come home, but she needs to convince us she can win those states instead.

That was the difference between Obama in 2012 and Hillary in 2016.

Governors now thanks to the midterm.

If there had been Democratic governors in place in 2016, Hillary could have won. As it is, she only lost by less than 80K votes across three states.

Biden has to defend his record, all of it. That is why we have primaries, to filter through stuff like what the OP posted.

It is not about who the polls say can beat Trump now, but about who people think can beat him after the debates happen.

advise Sanders to address his vote for the criminal justice bill too...and some of his votes on immigration and gun laws.

Trump offers only fear. No legislative solutions for the problems facing our country. Any candidate that comes out of an issue/ solution based primary will beat Trump. I want to seeBiden’s ideas and how they will help our country. I’m afraid that I see the bankruptcy bill as one of the worst bills for working class Americans, students and small entrepreneurs. I’m looking forward to hearing his perspective on what he did.

and reps the best interests of the People, which does not include corporations.


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

If this were so Warren would be winning.

But neither will a blue collar messenger without a message.

so far all I've gotten is "Trump sucks, Biden can win, and the sooner everyone realizes that, the better." I think there must be more, but nobody seems to want to tell me. Or maybe that's all we need to know?

Biden is for climate change legislation, healthcare (BFD), and he wrote the violence against women law...so woman's rights. He is for economic justice and criminal justice reform...and or course civil rights and

On January 21, 2019, Vice President Biden, the Chair of the Biden Institute at the University of Delaware, delivered remarks and was honored with the Lifetime of Excellence in Public Service Award at the annual Martin Luther King, Jr. Day breakfast hosted by Rev. Al Sharpton's National Action Network.

But I sure hope he isn't running as a generic Democrat. That's not a very exciting message.

and stood with Republicans in doing it.

But its still early & everyone hasnt yet begun to beat the hell out of each other.

still having influence.
Knowing about them is not tantamount to successfully doing anything about them.

Candidates are not even acknowledging or warning; many are trying to ignore or minimize-why? I consider such candidates weak on issues of democracy and equality

One answer is that candidates who believe their strength lies with harvesting the votes of male voters who may be disenchanted with Trump and prefer to vote for a male candidate.

Women were decisive in 2018 and will be decisive in 2020.

Trump may not be the candidate; so the meme of anyone who can beat Trump.

As of now, the only thing stopping him from running in '20 is if he says he's not going to.

Of course the russians are still active; but there are more people watching now than 2 yrs ago. And a candidate that harps on Russians wont look as strong IMO. Doesnt mean they cant have OTHERS bring it up though. I know its early, but i'm just a bit concerned about the direction of the campaign as a whole. Just not being trump isnt going to be enough. Too many people think he's going to lose to ANYONE by 10 points and i dont see it.

A former former staffer of Kasich was on NPR taking about the possibility.
(Boehner is warning Kasich against it). I see at least 3 camps in the Republican Party.

The Mueller report is making fault lines in the Republican Party more apparent. The investigations in the House may eventually make Trump's position untenable.

The Republican Party may reach a point where to save the party they will need to dump Trump. The party is not suicidal. I myself would like to see it become just a regional phenomenon but I don't see that happening in the near future.

There are still lots of Russian connection that may be revealed. I think we may have passed the point where Trump can do a war scare to tamp down opposition and that is good for us.

If Russia sees Trump becoming a liability Putin will support someone else; same with the Republican Party.

We can't afford to assume Trump will be there to run against.

We can't afford to not build on our 2018 gains in the House, or make gain in the Senate, nor can we afford to assume that a Democratic anti-Trump candidate will hurt Republicans in the house and senate-especially if our candidate builds a campaign geared too heavily to bipartisanship.

His base is unchanged & no Dems will cross over this primary.
For whatever reason, shit that would sink anyone else still just bounces off trump. Its ridiculous but its the "fool born every minute" phenomenon.
The 1st time i thought he was done for was during the debates when he refused to say he'd support the GOP nominee if it wasnt him. I've always known the GOP to really dislike those who arent "team players". But it didnt slow him at all. Then the McCain comments. Again, nothing. MANY times i've thought, "Well, this is it for him".
At this point i really dont know what could be revealed that would really turn the tide against him. Him being gay? A muslim? And still i'm not sure anymore!!

motive.

It's way too early to use polls as a measure of anything except name recognition at this point.

And right now, he's leading everyone else. Its up to the rest of the field to show why they would be better. And up to him to get people to believe he should be there.
I want to vote FOR someone more than i want to vote AGAINST someone.

But theres nothing much that any candidate can do about their supporters slinging mud. They can only control their own staff folks.

It won't work.

to beat tRump ... that you didn’t even try.

Here we go, for the next several months.

Graduates, Biden handcuffed you to debt and left women destitute.

It’s up to Biden to get a good strong response out there early.

and he will be glad to take their votes .So his candidacy will work against us. Our voters will lose enthusiasm, many Republicans and independents will crossover to Biden if Trump is candidate, if Republicans replace Trump before 2020 they may stick with their new party candidate anyway.

Biden will be actively seeking Republicans votes if he is the candidate and will do so under guise of "working across the aisle".

He already helped a Republican win in the house in the crucial 2018 election and would not help the Democratic opponent. He signaled then what his strategy will be in 2018 and the Republican Party has taken notice.

A Biden presidency, dependent upon Republican votes is a loss for our party and a Biden candidacy may limit our success down ballot in many states and in Congress in a crucial re-apportionment year.

We lost the re-apportionment power in many states in 2010, when Biden was vp and it hurt us badly as Republicans massively gerrymandered districts-so we when into subsequent election cycles badly weakened.

And i guess you're also against O'rourke, since HE worked with republicans too.
If theres going to be a purity contest, guess what, NONE of the 20 candidates are going to pass it. I could list the biggest problems with the top candidates, but i'd get a hide for doing it.

The only think that matters is who can beat trump.

"We lost the re-apportionment power in many states in 2010, when Biden was vp"

I dont know what Biden could have done about that.

The primaries are next year. Much can happen in between.

Nothing to do with purity contests

Nothing to do with working with Republicans -just whether aiming a campaign toward Republican voters helps them down ballot and endangers re-apportionment.

Losing in 2010 was extremely damaging to the Democratic Party. Republicans seized the opportunity to gerrymander and we lost even more seats.

The best way to accept Republican support is to tell them to become Democrats.

The best way to help Democratic candidates down ballot is to support them and not the opposition candidate.

I do not believed what Biden did in 2018 in his Michigan speech and his subsequent turning down the Democrat opponent who asked only that Biden offer a few word of support for him, is acceptable behavior.

To be a voter is to wield power - if we don not use our power what good is it?

She knows of what she speaks!!


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

of our issues.

she isn't making him out to be some horrible immoral corrupt person.

and left women destitute.

him? A primary is not a coronation.

I feel she's got a lot more to give than her opposition to Biden, so I hope there's more focus by the media on other stuff she's bringing to the table.

I hope it goes beyond the soundbite of "Biden was on the side of the credit card companies" and explain the bill, so people can understand and pressure whoever gets the nom to make changes and right the wrongs. When that's all we see/hear, I think it diminishes what/who she is. Just IMO, natch. :-7

We have so many good people running who are capable of helping this country heal.

That's part of the primary process and splains why Joe lost in that process twice before. That's not damage... that's democracy!!


Bernie & Elizabeth 2020!!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!

"Creature of Wall Street" doesn't mean corrupt, but does mean he has a blind spot when it comes to banks.


Sanders will say he is a horrible member of The Establishment.

Various others or their surrogates will say he's a great guy but pick holes in his record to highlight their own advantages.

He could die the death of 1000 cuts.

like Trump.

Everyone who has median income or above who files for bankruptcy has to follow the law's requirement for credit counseling and no one can discharge student loans no matter what.

as at 11/2009, 276 debtors had brought an adverbial suit for discharge and up to 11/2009, of the 134 resolutions, 29 resulted in total or partial discharge.

http://www.law.uh.edu/ihelg/monograph/11-01.pdf

That’s 29 full or partial discharges 2006 - 2009.

Warren's not going to be attacking our fellow Democrats. She's simply speaking of both her knowledge and her experience with opposing corporate greed.

Good people wind up on the wrong side of issues sometimes. Joe's good people. I love him and would be on his side if he goes to the general election.

Warren has been speaking up and doing everything she can to help the working class.

She is on the right side of these issues.

how it helps us get rid of a monster but guess that's secondary?

I love Elizabeth. Wish it could be her.

In 2016, the presumptive Republican candidate was supposed to be Jeb Bush, not Trump.

The winner of the presidential race was supposed to be Hillary Clinton, not Trump.

So I'm not buying the argument that Biden is the only candidate who can beat Trump. Nothing has been going according to plan for years, traditional wisdom is out the window, and this early in the game no one is a sure bet for anything.

of a monster.

(lol at Consumer Protection)

https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00044#position

Bold are still in the Senate

Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Biden (D-DE)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Byrd (D-WV)
Carper (D-DE)
Conrad (D-ND)
Inouye (D-HI)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kohl (D-WI)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reid (D-NV)
Salazar (D-CO)
Stabenow (D-MI)

Not Voting - 1
Clinton (D-NY) (supported its passage by was absent for final vote)

That turd Ben Nelson voted for it and anti-choice gay hating religious wackos still didn’t love him. Go figure.

I don't know, but doing the Republican's oppo work is not a good look for Elizabeth Warren.

Do you expect her to pull her punches?

It's hardly a secret to be ferreted out by opposition researchers.

having a Democratic president who will work for the credit card industry and against the people.

Biden is no longer the senator from Delaware-the credit card industry state.

Biden can let us know where he stands now and what he will do as president. Warren's criticism is an opportunity for Joseph Biden to address a crucial issue.

I think he should take that opportunity and be totally honest.

Just a hunch.