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In reply to the discussion: NYT Op-ed: Pardon Bush and Those Who Tortured [View all]merrily
(45,251 posts)27. Did you read my post? Stop with the foreign soil. We flew them from the US to places like Syria.
Or tortured them ourself on our own naval ships or our military bases, like Bagram. (Our naval ships and our military bases are not foreign soil, or McCain would not have been eligible to run for US President, nor would anyone born on a military base.)
I suppose you can grant me there is a difference between the wo processes.
Yup. Geography is the difference. That and, as I said in my prior post, extraordinary rendition may well be be even less moral than owning our torture. Torture anyway is ineffective and illegal. And being tortured because of the US in Syria or on a US naval ship hardly affects whether the detainee becomes a hero or not, or whether anyone sees us as villains or not. Why on earth would it? Did we save face by torturing Abu Ghraib prisoners--and we didn't even arrest some of those people. Seems as though you are straining to find some reason to distinguish ER that just doesn't exist in the real world.
Why are you are trying so hard to make extraordinary rendition to Syria or torture by us on a naval ship or a base like Bagram seem better than torture at ring in Gitmo (our base in Cuba is no more or less US soil than is our base in Bagram). Do you have a moral reason for that?
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Sorry to disagree, but a UN treaty to which the US is party and domestic law already prove
merrily
Dec 2014
#2
What part of "unofficial" is too complicated for you? Didn't prosecute, did he? Just let the
merrily
Dec 2014
#14
Yes, and I appreciate that. However, there is legal technicality and then there is public
merrily
Dec 2014
#31
Ford clung to that after he pardoned Nixon, but a lot of people think it means you were not
merrily
Dec 2014
#19
The point that I got listening to him was that if the case is left unsettled then the door is left
jwirr
Dec 2014
#28
Committing genocide, including of Jews who are fellow Germans in Germany, is not a war.
merrily
Dec 2014
#16
The other reason for a pardon is that it eliminates their 5th Amendment shelter
Algernon Moncrieff
Dec 2014
#4
I agree but how are we going to get a prosecution? If it were that easy it should have been done a
jwirr
Dec 2014
#30
Extraordinary rendition is not what you are describing. It is forcing people often uncharged with
uppityperson
Dec 2014
#26