Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

MineralMan

(146,369 posts)
40. Non-violence is an outstanding principle, when used by masses
Wed Aug 16, 2017, 01:34 PM
Aug 2017

of people against a sane adversary. Almost all of the counter-protesters in Charlottesville were completely non-violent. A few were not, and took the battle to the nazis who were there. In that particular instance, non-violence by the counter-protesters was the response, and it worked just fine.

However, non-violence is a principle that is totally useless against an group of people that seeks to mete out violence as its primary strategy. Non-violence in such situations gets people dead and injured. That occurred with the driver of the car that ran down people in a street in Charlottesville.

Where non-violent opposition is effective and does not result in a failure to respond to actual violence, it is the strategy of choice. However, if the force being opposed is set on using violence, regardless of non-violent opposition, then it is not a useful strategy and accomplishes little.

When someone points a gun at you with the intent to shoot you, if you stand silently in defiance, you are likely to die or be gravely injured. If you run away as fast as you can, you have a greater chance to survive. If you shoot your attacker before he can fire and end the threat, you may save not only your own life, but perhaps the lives of others.

Non-violent opposition works well when the threat is not deadly. It works poorly when the people you oppose seek to kill you as their strategy. In the best case, you should avoid being in that situation. If you find yourself in that situation, however, you should either flee or defend yourself in a way that is appropriate to the attack. Fleeing is nonviolent. Standing defenseless, however, is simply foolish.

Yes, lets learn the lessons of history. Eko Aug 2017 #1
There was considerable violence in Germany before Hitler marylandblue Aug 2017 #2
No. They didn't do the same thing. If, when 100 nazis show up, we show up with 5000, and Squinch Aug 2017 #5
Showing up with 65,853,516 against their 62,984,825 put a Nazi sympathizer in the Whitehouse Orrex Aug 2017 #12
You know that is a silly analogy. Squinch Aug 2017 #13
Yes, because I know that dogmatic insistence upon non-violence is silly Orrex Aug 2017 #14
So I guess Dr. King was just a silly guy. And Ghandi was a joke, huh? Squinch Aug 2017 #16
That is your claim, not mine Orrex Aug 2017 #20
You keep saying that King was not non-violent. He never acted against his non-violence message. Squinch Aug 2017 #21
Why did he maintain an arsenal? For hunting? Orrex Aug 2017 #24
Did Dr. King ever shoot anyone? Did he ever stray from his message of non-violence? Squinch Aug 2017 #26
The question is not "did he" but rather "would he have?" Orrex Aug 2017 #30
So, you seem to be saying that King's non-violence was a show, and Squinch Aug 2017 #31
That's clearly and certainly not what I'm saying. Orrex Aug 2017 #34
You know MLK and Malcolm moved closer together in their views. brush Aug 2017 #29
You don't turn the other cheek to Nazis who are determined to kill you dalton99a Aug 2017 #3
That all sounds wonderful but it's not the same Phoenix61 Aug 2017 #4
What you are describing about the image of liberals is a good description of the image of Squinch Aug 2017 #6
Martin Luther King Jr. maintained a substantial arsenal of firearms Orrex Aug 2017 #7
+1 dalton99a Aug 2017 #10
Did he ever violently defend himself? Did he pull one of those guns in Selma? Did they Squinch Aug 2017 #15
I agree wholeheartedly. kentuck Aug 2017 #8
While I can appreciate the sentiment leftynyc Aug 2017 #9
Exactly. If you advocate non-violent protests at all times against Nazis KitSileya Aug 2017 #36
Yup... Adrahil Aug 2017 #38
That's why they were so happy with leftynyc Aug 2017 #41
To quote Stokely Carmichael, Nonviolence only works if your enemy has a conscience. backscatter712 Aug 2017 #11
Who turned the tide? Was it Charmichael or King? There is no question that violence is justified Squinch Aug 2017 #17
"Nonviolence only works if your enemy has a conscience." workinclasszero Aug 2017 #19
We aren't talking about the Nazi's conscience, we are trying to get HopeAgain Aug 2017 #27
Exactly. summer_in_TX Aug 2017 #42
No offense, but you sound like Trump leftstreet Aug 2017 #18
That is a horribly offensive thing to say to that poster. "No offense but" makes it all the Squinch Aug 2017 #23
No, it's not leftstreet Aug 2017 #25
This message was self-deleted by its author jmg257 Aug 2017 #22
Don't confuse nonviolence with refusal to defend yourself Lee-Lee Aug 2017 #28
The tide of public opinion is already against these fucksticks Egnever Aug 2017 #32
Non-violence is a POLITICAL tactic and only for the brave marylandblue Aug 2017 #33
This message was self-deleted by its author jmg257 Aug 2017 #35
Of course its tragic, and I am not brave enough marylandblue Aug 2017 #37
This message was self-deleted by its author jmg257 Aug 2017 #39
Non-violence is an outstanding principle, when used by masses MineralMan Aug 2017 #40
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Non-violent tactics and m...»Reply #40