General Discussion

ExciteBike66

(2,424 posts)

86. Because it's not a racial incident

Mon Apr 16, 2018, 12:39 PM

Apr 2018

would be my guess.

Do you ever hear about white people getting shot by the cops (other than on your local news, from your local area)? It does happen, you know.

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The Starbucks thing... [View all] ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 OP

local starbucks donates all kinds of food to my church to feed the hungry dembotoz Apr 2018 #1

Fire the manager. Racism can not be tolerated. Until this happens, Starbucks is dead to me. Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #157

Ownership must be held accountable for management practices backtoblue Apr 2018 #2

One again I believe this was a failure of the police to properly assess the situation and Kirk Lover Apr 2018 #11

But the guys did not obey the police order to leave ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #46

The police didn't even check to see if this complaint was valid. nt Kirk Lover Apr 2018 #49

How do you check? Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #53

You check by talking to people which these officers did not do. Kirk Lover Apr 2018 #56

nope Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #68

Then Starbucks needs to put up sings saying no loitering - whatever...because selective Kirk Lover Apr 2018 #73

That is up to Starbucks Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #76

Did they explain that to the guys? I'm sorry fellas but by law we have to escort you out of Kirk Lover Apr 2018 #84

We do not know Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #103

But Starbucks should have a clearer policy... MountCleaners Apr 2018 #239

I thought the rule of buying something was about homeless people coming in and making demigoddess Apr 2018 #201

These men are real estate professionals who were waiting for a man with tblue37 Apr 2018 #258

yes, I know that, I guess my double negative was not done right. demigoddess Apr 2018 #309

I wonder if a 60 yr old non POC female in a Gucci dress with a Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #77

Or a 70ish White Male IllinoisBirdWatcher Apr 2018 #95

Friend of mine uses them for the internet in big city all the time. Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #96

This is what is so nauseating to me as a black woman every time I read the comments tulipsandroses Apr 2018 #355

especially since it most white people, if asked to leave under these circumstances, would scream EffieBlack Apr 2018 #356

Why didn't they leave??? Why didn't Rosa Parks give up her seat? Why did the folks sitting a lunch Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #408

There was one in there 2 hours that hadn't bought a thing sarah FAILIN Apr 2018 #187

No doubt, Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #218

I Am Not Speaking RobinA Apr 2018 #143

Are the Starbucks with the signs about restrooms only in black neighborhoods..? I sincerely Kirk Lover Apr 2018 #146

They let a non paying person use ithe while this went on. sarah FAILIN Apr 2018 #189

Cool Story ChubbyStar Apr 2018 #58

LOL Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #63

Here is how the police check if the complaint if valid: ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #62

So when you have what amounts to this happen BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #71

yep Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #80

Think about the alternative ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #83

That happens when white boys trash a bar BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #91

I went to UCONN, so I know all about it. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #114

And I graduated from UMASS 35 years ago BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #122

Since you have been to UCONN ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #272

You do realize that BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #279

That and the dairy bar are part of UCONN's charm. CentralMass Apr 2018 #354

When black people tip over cars, set fires and run through the streets, its a riot. EffieBlack Apr 2018 #244

Very true...this is about discrimination pure and simple. There is no justification for the behavior Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #420

What a reasonable cop should do in this situation sdfernando Apr 2018 #102

That would also have worked, true ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #115

"cops generally won't give the benefit of the doubt to people who do not obey them" sdfernando Apr 2018 #139

I agree ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #267

Cops also arrest Black people and kill them in situations where a white person would not suffer Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #413

CONTEXT MountCleaners Apr 2018 #240

My problem is that I don't think the context applies here ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #274

Exactly this. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #124

Yes, that is how it works Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #90

The prudent course of action BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #98

No Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #110

Uh "not no" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #116

You are correct Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #130

And when a city has had enough of the multimillion dollar lawsuits BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #132

That's great Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #133

"they did their job without excessive use of force and no physical injury to anyone involved. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #136

Yes Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #149

"The FACT is they did not get shot, beaten, or tasered." BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #161

"Criminal trespass" is NOT "defined by the accuser" when the accuser EffieBlack Apr 2018 #152

yes, it is Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #159

The cops no doubt asked the manager mythology Apr 2018 #259

"entire list of people who had a relevant opinion." BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #264

This message was self-deleted by its author ChubbyStar Apr 2018 #118

What was the "criminal trespsss?" EffieBlack Apr 2018 #144

simple Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #158

Wow EffieBlack Apr 2018 #163

ok Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #176

It doesn't work that way BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #183

No shit Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #191

The direction they have taken this is a bit horrifying. NCTraveler Apr 2018 #169

I'm appalled EffieBlack Apr 2018 #179

If the men owned the shop it wouldn't be trespassing, you're line of action is out of uponit7771 Apr 2018 #147

"since they don't want to serve no niggers, you are supposed to get up and leave. " NCTraveler Apr 2018 #165

And that is where we disagree BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #186

This is a horrifically backward statement. NCTraveler Apr 2018 #192

Perhaps you are misinterpreting where I am coming from. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #197

Right Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #205

See this post - BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #208

If the owner (or agent of - a manager, etc) asks you to leave and you do not, that is trespassing. X_Digger Apr 2018 #256

The "manager" is NOT the "owner" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #263

No, you are wrong Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #282

This issue was found to be without merit BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #284

DAs often do that afterwords. More facts to come be known Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #287

And in this case BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #290

Some private property is also open to the public. Trespassing applies to both. X_Digger Apr 2018 #286

Just being "present" without causing a disruption BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #289

Actually yes it can Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #292

Um no BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #293

No, thats not why they didnt pursue charges Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #295

OMFG BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #297

Here we go again BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #345

Being present after having been asked to leave- is trespassing. BY DEFINITION. X_Digger Apr 2018 #344

Being "asked to leave" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #349

No such rule is needed. I know Title II law quite well, thanks. It doesn't negate property rights. X_Digger Apr 2018 #357

"It doesn't negate property rights." BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #359

Federal CIVIL law does not trump state CRIMINAL law. X_Digger Apr 2018 #361

There was no finding of a violation of "criminal law" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #363

A "finding" is a trial. There was no trial. Get your terminology straight. X_Digger Apr 2018 #368

I suggest that you not try to impose a theory onto my terminology BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #370

It's applicable because a DA refusing to charge has no bearing on whether a crime was committed. X_Digger Apr 2018 #372

The entirety of the power structure admitted they were wrong BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #375

Yes, it is. Because the property owner said so. Not because of the DA. n/t X_Digger Apr 2018 #376

It's over. All parties have moved on. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #378

I hope that you've at least gotten an education in trespassing, property rights, and Title II. n/t X_Digger Apr 2018 #379

I hope you understand how silly "whitesplaining" is when in denial of reality. nt BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #380

Well, my hope is crushed. Missed it by that much. n/t X_Digger Apr 2018 #381

Too bad. I expect it was fun while it lasted. nt BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #382

I'm still waiting for what the operator tells you when you claim discrimination. X_Digger Apr 2018 #383

It's over. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #384

C'mon, I really want to know what they say. X_Digger Apr 2018 #385

Let it go. It will make you feel better. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #386

Aww, toddle off. n/t X_Digger Apr 2018 #387

But if the manager asks you to leave because you are Black it violates the law as well. Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #406

And you sue later, for a civil violation. Criminal v civil. One doesn't negate the other. n/t X_Digger Apr 2018 #414

Get real...that would never work...nope in the tradition of Rosa Parks and other brave Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #424

I have been in management since my early twenties in south Tampa... NCTraveler Apr 2018 #427

I have also been a manager for 20 of the 30+ years I worked in a federal agency before retiring BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #431

That is exactly right...it is Jim Crow rearing its ugly head. Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #411

So, if the store or coffee shop owner is racist and wants to remove POC, the police Doodley Apr 2018 #107

Yes, the police have to do it. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #111

They have to do it? Since when have the police "had to" do anything? Doodley Apr 2018 #117

Pretty much. Here is how it works on a trespassing call- this will vary slightly by state. Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #276

The police don't have to do shit. hunter Apr 2018 #334

Thats not how it works. At all Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #335

Damn, our cops don't even feel obligated to pick up shoplifters. hunter Apr 2018 #343

When I was a deputy every call for service got a response Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #350

Cops don't have any greater duty to shop managers than they do shop patrons. hunter Apr 2018 #374

Actually, yes they do. Read the law Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #393

Yours is an excellent post BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #351

So, if a shop has ten POC and ten whites and store owner tells police the POC are trespassing. Doodley Apr 2018 #463

Apparently EffieBlack Apr 2018 #465

Yep. That doesnt mean the POC cant seek remedies via the courts for civil rights violations Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #469

So managers can call the police, demand they toss people out of their shops for whatever reason they EffieBlack Apr 2018 #472

Thats the truth. I was a deputy for over 10 years and thats how the law is Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #473

Where were you a deputy? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #474

You really are not comprehending the law here. Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #478

Not for the police to decide treestar Apr 2018 #483

I wonder what would have happened if Rosa Parks had obeyed police orders ? Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #417

No change would have occurred treestar Apr 2018 #484

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2018 #492

Two white people say we are waiting on a friend California_Republic Apr 2018 #3

I don't know ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #6

Ok got it California_Republic Apr 2018 #18

wrong, they do not obamanut2012 Apr 2018 #19

I have been to Starbucks in Cleveland and ever seen such a sign...sound like bullshit to me. Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #415

I've worked in restaurants and retail PatSeg Apr 2018 #65

They would have met their friend and no one would have heard a thing about it. nt. NCTraveler Apr 2018 #170

This incident has been blown out of proportion. The manager handled it terribly. YOHABLO Apr 2018 #4

Those two black men were one wrong move away from being shot, one wrong word, NOT blown Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #82

but that's exactly it, white people who are not disturbing anyone at starbucks don't get arrested. unblock Apr 2018 #5

I totally agree on the traffic enforcement thing. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #12

I think you nailed it True Dough Apr 2018 #13

Thrown out if not ordering, yes, arrested, no. whathehell Apr 2018 #40

other patrons said that there were white people there who had been there longer without ordering unblock Apr 2018 #45

Yes, I'm listening to Progressive Radio right now, whathehell Apr 2018 #126

The manager is now "gone" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #129

I've seen white males harass and disturb people at Starbucks without purchase IronLionZion Apr 2018 #59

Believe me, if they'd been white it would be news 24/7 leftstreet Apr 2018 #7

See I don't agree at all ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #15

You just made my point leftstreet Apr 2018 #20

You know what I meant ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #30

It would be all over Fox News if they were obvious white christians. xor Apr 2018 #198

I agree somewhat California_Republic Apr 2018 #22

there are certainly some white people who would claim that if a black store owner tossed them out. unblock Apr 2018 #23

Sure, but would WE believe them? ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #32

that's the point. unblock Apr 2018 #34

Yep. If they were white, they would have simply met their friend. nt. NCTraveler Apr 2018 #174

The manager is a known racist... HipChick Apr 2018 #8

I haven't been able to identify the manager, ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #16

It's a her...and there is an HR case HipChick Apr 2018 #26

+1. Makes sense dalton99a Apr 2018 #37

I believe it. Its going to be a big dust up when we debate how.... Anon-C Apr 2018 #54

I wonder why that is? HipChick Apr 2018 #79

Social position enforcement. Especially if they "feel" they have very little power to begin with. haele Apr 2018 #209

like whoa !!! uponit7771 Apr 2018 #148

What is her name? How do you know this? Tipperary Apr 2018 #150

Have you heard of this tool? HipChick Apr 2018 #168

Boom! ChubbyStar Apr 2018 #173

How about backing up a claim you make melman Apr 2018 #180

I don't google for people.. HipChick Apr 2018 #185

Revealing, is it not? Smh. Tipperary Apr 2018 #418

Some reason you do not want to answer? Tipperary Apr 2018 #416

I've been asked to order something or leave many times. pintobean Apr 2018 #9

It isn't Starbucks policy obamanut2012 Apr 2018 #21

So Those Signs RobinA Apr 2018 #155

Did someone state that? ChubbyStar Apr 2018 #164

A white woman said she got the code for the bathroom from an employee and used the EffieBlack Apr 2018 #167

OK, if you say you've been asked to leave many times, that this shit happens all the time in... Anon-C Apr 2018 #109

If that happened to me one time, I think I would order something while I waited the next time. Tipperary Apr 2018 #137

I Havent Either RobinA Apr 2018 #160

Starbucks is a franchise NewJeffCT Apr 2018 #10

Never used to be a franchise. Pretty sure it isnt. Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #87

I stand corrected NewJeffCT Apr 2018 #128

Wow. Denny's was notorious for doing this sort of thing BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #131

There are some franchise locations... JHB Apr 2018 #171

Inside the US? If you have specific info about this I would be interested to know. Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #219

It looks like the technical term for it is "licensed store"..: JHB Apr 2018 #223

I have always wanted to own one, anybody would. Which is why I ask. Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #224

It is 100% the fault of the Starbucks manager obamanut2012 Apr 2018 #14

Many businesses in cities have locked bathrooms ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #24

Starbucks already fired the manager, so IMO, that says something about how they assessed hlthe2b Apr 2018 #17

Hadn't heard trhat -- good! obamanut2012 Apr 2018 #25

Maybe Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #39

I cannot find anything saying the manager was fired, ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #28

I read it in an article Sunday hlthe2b Apr 2018 #29

No. They are not required to arrest hlthe2b Apr 2018 #31

Then my question is what else can they do in that situation? ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #42

It is not at all clear they refused to leave. Taking them outside to discuss was step 1. Instead hlthe2b Apr 2018 #69

According to the news, both the starbucks employees and the cops asked them to leave. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #92

there were different accounts over the weekend. Sounds like SB & police got their story together hlthe2b Apr 2018 #97

Customers have no say in whether fellow customers are trespassing Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #177

I expect police to be professionals and to question EVERY situation. Perhaps you can consider this hlthe2b Apr 2018 #181

That's a very different scenario. Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #195

And only the police are able to identify if a law was broken. They must prove refusal to leave. hlthe2b Apr 2018 #217

Refusing to leave does. (As was the case here.) n/t X_Digger Apr 2018 #257

This message was self-deleted by its author ChubbyStar Apr 2018 #182

But they ARE evidence of whether the manager is really enforcing EffieBlack Apr 2018 #184

Absolutely - as to the first Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #193

It is indeed for the police to decide! EffieBlack Apr 2018 #200

The fact that someone they have been asked to remove is black Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #216

Regardless of race, the police are not employed by business owners EffieBlack Apr 2018 #220

the law from Pen is posted #204 Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #229

I never argued that that the police were required to arrest the individual. Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #234

The same principal applies to removal from the premises EffieBlack Apr 2018 #242

I'll repeat what I posted elsewhere EffieBlack Apr 2018 #175

And I will repeat my response to that, which is ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #269

Yea, they do have to place you in custody Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #43

NO. not if they do not find a crime. They are NOT required to simply take the word of the manager. hlthe2b Apr 2018 #66

Did you read the post? Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #72

Did you even read the article? GulfCoast66 Apr 2018 #120

The cops are SUPPOSED to diffuse the situation BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #142

I understand community policing GulfCoast66 Apr 2018 #156

"the police must enforce that request. " BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #172

You are confusing trespass with public accommodations Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #190

Um no I'm not BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #196

Every property owner, including public accommodations, has the right to have trespassers removed. Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #204

What? BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #207

ok Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #212

"if, knowing that he is not licensed or privileged to do so" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #213

It is kind of funny now Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #221

No, you have manufactured a different meaning BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #231

Criminal trespass has fuck all to do w/ private v public X_Digger Apr 2018 #261

Again BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #266

Seriously- civil law is not enforced by criminal law enforcement. X_Digger Apr 2018 #288

Do you really think that BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #291

Cops don't get involved in civil issues, generally. X_Digger Apr 2018 #346

I posted the 911 (and police scanner) recordings in the other thread BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #348

"refusing to leave" -- black letter trespassing. Derp. n/t X_Digger Apr 2018 #352

Violation of Civil Rights. Bankruptable offense. Duh. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #353

If because of a protected class membership, yes. But it does not negate the trespassing. X_Digger Apr 2018 #358

"If because of a protected class membership, yes." BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #360

CIVIL LAW IS NOT CRIMINAL LAW. For fuck's sake. X_Digger Apr 2018 #362

Dead horse dead horse dead horse BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #364

I'll stop when you demonstrate comprehension of the difference. X_Digger Apr 2018 #369

There is this concept called "denial" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #371

First you asserted that places subject to public accommodation aren't subject to trespassing laws... X_Digger Apr 2018 #373

Wake up. It's over. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #377

So ... Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #365

Did you listen to the 911 recording & police scanner recordings that were posted? BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #366

Review 3503(b)(1)(i) Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #230

And this was disputed BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #235

Are you an attorney or involved in law enforcement? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #202

Yes. Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #206

Then I'm surprised EffieBlack Apr 2018 #210

Such a professional response. Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #228

The police do not have to prove that the manager is engaging in racial discrimination EffieBlack Apr 2018 #237

The statute seems relatively clear in this case, as do the facts Ms. Toad Apr 2018 #238

The issue of trespass is pretty clear treestar Apr 2018 #485

You get the police force you deserve. My community does not hire drones, but professionals hlthe2b Apr 2018 #487

They don't have to be drones to treestar Apr 2018 #488

you justify police who do not question and who you claim have no ability to discern... Obvioully the hlthe2b Apr 2018 #489

Which the DA was there to do treestar Apr 2018 #490

Like I said, you defend the kind of policing that involves no thinking whatsoever. hlthe2b Apr 2018 #491

I'm sure they did some thinking treestar Apr 2018 #493

Starbucks manager leaves company after arrest of Black men sparks outrage hlthe2b Apr 2018 #75

Now not "mutual"... Anon-C Apr 2018 #199

Maybe cops should start being held accountable for things like this Proud Liberal Dem Apr 2018 #35

when they do something wrong, for sure Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #47

This Starbucks arrest certainly seems wrongful Proud Liberal Dem Apr 2018 #50

Starbucks has not fired the manager - today's Philly paper: dalton99a Apr 2018 #36

WRONG: Starbucks manager leaves company after arrest of Black men sparks outrage hlthe2b Apr 2018 #74

Thank you for that update! BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #106

No franchises with Starbucks , unless this changed in the last couple years Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #89

They arent franchises. They are corporately run blake2012 Apr 2018 #123

I heard that the manager Tipperary Apr 2018 #138

I've repeatedly posted links... Post 74, Post 75 hlthe2b Apr 2018 #141

If a person is just hanging out without being an actual paying customer democratisphere Apr 2018 #27

Most people wait to order until their party is all there. dchill Apr 2018 #153

Read this article - gives explanations. salin Apr 2018 #33

Thanks, this gives a lot more detail than the stories on my google news. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #38

So since you "read the article" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #78

Why would I do that? ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #94

Of course you wouldn't. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #100

White Privilege and racial profiling.. HipChick Apr 2018 #41

Very good article blake2012 Apr 2018 #127

Starbucks is a Seattle company with Seattle values.. this store did NOT follow their values.. samnsara Apr 2018 #44

Right Lurker Deluxe Apr 2018 #48

I think closing the store is a bit extreme. Firing the manager and staff involved? Yes. Caliman73 Apr 2018 #145

Other people work there, and patrons treestar Apr 2018 #486

You are exactly wrong. dchill Apr 2018 #51

I think you are right. Denis 11 Apr 2018 #52

Race and discrimination are not binary things EffieBlack Apr 2018 #55

True, but... ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #67

"What else can you do but detain or arrest them?" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #88

Whoa ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #99

That is what they do to WHITES. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #101

An arrest is discretionary EffieBlack Apr 2018 #93

I agree that would have been nicer, ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #104

What Effie wrote is called "Conflict Resolution" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #112

But that implies that there is a mutual resolution available. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #113

People are TRAINED to work that out. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #119

If the manager insists that the men leave but can't prove the store has EffieBlack Apr 2018 #140

I agree 100% that the problem was probably the manager ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #270

I dont expect them to invesitigate civil rights complaints EffieBlack Apr 2018 #296

Please do not insult me ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #298

Im not insulting you at all - just stating a fact EffieBlack Apr 2018 #300

Implying that I am papering over racism is an insult. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #301

Thats not an insult EffieBlack Apr 2018 #304

But my question to you is still this: ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #305

The witnesses said none of this was done. They walked in and told the men to leave EffieBlack Apr 2018 #308

Well, they must have spoken to the manager before giving that order, ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #316

Then they shouldve have taken 30 more seconds to ask a couple of questions EffieBlack Apr 2018 #322

Maybe, maybe not ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #324

I wanted to add something: a few questions ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #299

I partly answered these questions in the response I just posted EffieBlack Apr 2018 #302

My fault that we are cross-posting ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #303

My understanding is that they were not asked to leave by the manager, but I will check EffieBlack Apr 2018 #306

Their own lawyer said the manager asked them to leave. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #315

I still don't understand why they were asked to leave mcar Apr 2018 #310

Are you white or black or brown? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #312

You probably can guess mcar Apr 2018 #331

No I agree with you ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #314

You are going out of your way to give a benefit of the doubt to everyone but the two black men EffieBlack Apr 2018 #134

I dont think you understand how trespassing laws work Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #398

Except cops cant make up new parts of the law on the spot as they go along. Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #396

a week ago an associate and i attended a meeting about 90 miles from home. we met at a starbucks to dembotoz Apr 2018 #57

I am familiar with the environment at Starbucks ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #61

I have mixed feelings about this PatSeg Apr 2018 #60

Buy something in order to hang out crazycatlady Apr 2018 #64

The problem with these stories... titaniumsalute Apr 2018 #70

Why would a White person being removed NOT be in the news? catbyte Apr 2018 #81

Because it's not a racial incident ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #86

Are you kidding me? Of course media reports White people being shot by police--it just almost catbyte Apr 2018 #105

Maybe I am off base on the shootings, ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #108

But they weren't two Black kids being tossed out of Starbucks--they were two men catbyte Apr 2018 #125

Are YOU Kidding? RobinA Apr 2018 #194

Not by percentage BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #226

The Poster RobinA Apr 2018 #253

In the scheme of things BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #262

You certainly seem invested in that unproven narrative. LanternWaste Apr 2018 #236

This is an insult, you should apologize. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #268

I think it is wrong not to let someone use the bathroom...if she/he needs a bathroom, they need CTyankee Apr 2018 #85

Fuck that shit. If other white patrons right there are calling Ng BS blake2012 Apr 2018 #121

"The starbucks thing"...................... Afromania Apr 2018 #135

This whole thing is such f'ing bullshit grumpyduck Apr 2018 #151

It is not Starbuck Policy to have to buy something...I have sat in there for hours working Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #154

Waiting to meet friends at a coffee shop is a norm, not an exception. nt NCTraveler Apr 2018 #162

I haven't had time to dig into the details on this yet, but a couple of my thoughts on it xor Apr 2018 #166

Glad to hear the manager is gone...barista should go too. Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #178

I never go to Starbucks, don't drink coffee. phylny Apr 2018 #188

The Starbucks ellie Apr 2018 #203

This is my fault... Blue_Tires Apr 2018 #211

I hope this isn't pointed at me ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #271

And for the millionth time Blue_Tires Apr 2018 #311

I only use the word the police have used. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #313

But the D.A. (Prosecutors) REFUSED to call what was being alleged BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #317

That's fine, ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #318

The definition is the definition but the applicability was ERRONEOUS. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #320

Actually, they got it right from the legal perspective ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #321

No they didn't BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #323

Did you even read the definitions I provided? ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #325

Did you forget where you even got them from? BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #326

Wow ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #327

You torpedoed your argument BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #328

The point is that the facts fit the definition of a crime ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #329

You were not there BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #342

Funny, you weren't there either... ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #389

Read this article BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #392

You need to do some research before claiming I am wrong about what was said. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #394

It's remarkable that from what has been posted BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #395

Egads man, are you blind? ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #397

Your scotoma continues BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #399

Ok, I see the problem I think ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #400

To respond BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #401

I did miss that, thanks! ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #402

And again BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #404

This is a bit obtuse. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #407

To continue BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #425

You are ignoring the fact that the police already knew a crime was committed ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #428

What? BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #432

Ok, you need to read what I am writing ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #435

I quoted what you wrote BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #436

I'm getting a bit tired of your nonsense ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #447

You are "tired" of being challenged I suspect BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #452

You are still refusing the make sense ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #455

I am making perfect sense BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #458

You are repeating things I already addressed, which makes no sense. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #459

In response BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #464

I'm glad you corrected my mistake (which still has no bearing on anything, but thanks!) ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #466

In reply BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #467

Ok, this is my last post to you. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #468

Good. BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #470

Excellent analogy EffieBlack Apr 2018 #439

There are so many posts in this thread BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #443

God bless you for trying - but I think it's for naught EffieBlack Apr 2018 #445

I know BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #450

I shouldn't have said it's for naught or not penetrating since I've learned a lot from you in this EffieBlack Apr 2018 #451

My brain is fried BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #453

I found the "loitering" ordinance from Philly: only applies to sidewalks and such passages. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #319

fair enough... Blue_Tires Apr 2018 #340

Half of the actors were right, half were wrong. SomethingNew Apr 2018 #214

You're blaming the victims but not the people who arrested them EffieBlack Apr 2018 #222

No it's not. SomethingNew Apr 2018 #241

I assume youre being facetious, but youre not far off EffieBlack Apr 2018 #243

This suggestion is completely divorced from reality. SomethingNew Apr 2018 #245

No - it is actually how police are TRAINED to handle these situations EffieBlack Apr 2018 #246

So what do you propose they do if SomethingNew Apr 2018 #247

They can do one of two things EffieBlack Apr 2018 #248

Wow. SomethingNew Apr 2018 #249

Trying to use law enforcement to eject law-abiding people from your shop EffieBlack Apr 2018 #250

Saying who is and who is not allowed in SomethingNew Apr 2018 #251

I will pray that you don't ever end up on a jury deciding the fate of a cop EffieBlack Apr 2018 #254

This message was self-deleted by its author ChubbyStar Apr 2018 #255

I know you must be kidding. This has to be performance art. X_Digger Apr 2018 #260

You clearly dont have a clue what the cops job is Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #280

Thanks for that clear explanation. KY_EnviroGuy Apr 2018 #341

In that sense trespass means be told you are no longer permitted on the property Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #347

Thanks again for those clarifications. KY_EnviroGuy Apr 2018 #388

The police should've assessed the situation better, the men were never asked to leave uponit7771 Apr 2018 #233

I've read that they were never asked to leave or told the policy ecstatic Apr 2018 #215

The company itself is condemning the company, and the manager has been terminated. Crunchy Frog Apr 2018 #225

THANK you! EffieBlack Apr 2018 #227

+1, "It is also NOT company policy that you have to buy something to hang out." This i what I uponit7771 Apr 2018 #232

In most Starbucks stores in urban areas they do have this policy oberliner Apr 2018 #265

+ 1 Quixote1818 Apr 2018 #252

"the store manager might have been a racist, but that is probably something we will never betsuni Apr 2018 #273

My main points were about Starbucks and the cops, not the manager. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #275

I do see your point... Mike Nelson Apr 2018 #277

This is very true, the company is appearing to take this seriously. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #278

Ok here is how trespassing laws work from the cops perspective Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #281

This is a concise and easy to understand description, thanks! ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #283

Ive been on these calls that I knew were bullshit Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #285

"I imagine Starbucks will attempt to make it up to these guys somehow." - There will be... PoliticAverse Apr 2018 #330

I can not tell you the number of times I have waited for friends at coffee shops before ordering gollygee Apr 2018 #294

Interesting... tonedevil Apr 2018 #307

The fact that so many people here not only see nothing wrong with what happened, but EffieBlack Apr 2018 #332

Well, remember when the store clerk wouldn't show an expensive purse to Oprah? Phentex Apr 2018 #338

There's a reason THIS time it isn't racism. EffieBlack Apr 2018 #339

You are insulting me ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #336

My guess is that the manager is a "racist but" TexasBushwhacker Apr 2018 #333

You are serious with this? Dyedinthewoolliberal Apr 2018 #337

Have you read through the thread? I think I am clearly serious. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #390

The question is why are you making such a huge deal of it? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #440

You accuse me of ignoring centuries of discrimination ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #449

I don't believe this was an attempt to understand or to help you decide "whether" to condemn the EffieBlack Apr 2018 #454

I don't think we can agree on much here. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #457

Since OP has threatened to ignore me, he probably won't read this, but I'm writing this for those EffieBlack Apr 2018 #461

There is no policy torius Apr 2018 #367

I agree that there doesn't seem to have been a company-wide policy ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #391

What you don't seem to understand - or refuse to understand EffieBlack Apr 2018 #426

But this isn't even true. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #430

With each of these posts, you further prove my point EffieBlack Apr 2018 #438

Listen closely please ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #448

some who are having problems with this..... Civic Justice Apr 2018 #403

Not a good idea ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #410

certainly not the best idea... "I said that to make a point"... Civic Justice Apr 2018 #419

I figured ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #421

my comments are not directed at you.... why would you think that? Civic Justice Apr 2018 #422

LOL ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #423

"I am always open to being proven wrong, though." EffieBlack Apr 2018 #442

And this was within the lifetime of many of us or our parents EffieBlack Apr 2018 #441

The store is likely to be shut down MichMan Apr 2018 #405

For one thing, is calling the cops the only option? JNelson6563 Apr 2018 #409

Not the only option, no ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #412

The manager's action was the core of the problem. JNelson6563 Apr 2018 #429

Oh come on ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #433

I believe it was due to inaction JNelson6563 Apr 2018 #434

Or why not just let them stay? What was the problem? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #444

Couldn't agree more! JNelson6563 Apr 2018 #480

The problem I have is TNLib Apr 2018 #437

Perhaps because she feared that the other people who were doing the same thing would call her out EffieBlack Apr 2018 #446

Thats the problem its an inconsistent treatment of people TNLib Apr 2018 #456

According to the former lawyer for the two men, she did ask them to leave. ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #462

Example of police officer who didn't think his only option was an arrest because someone complained EffieBlack Apr 2018 #460

The difference in these cases Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #471

The Starbucks case also didn't have a violation of the law until the police officers decided, EffieBlack Apr 2018 #475

Thats just not true Lee-Lee Apr 2018 #477

One of the young men who was arrested is Rayshon Nelson Izzy Blue Apr 2018 #476

Thank you for that update BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #479

I have seen her id'd as Holly Hilton, ExciteBike66 Apr 2018 #482

dumbass manager. but they fired her ass. pansypoo53219 Apr 2018 #481